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32 of 40 chronically ill have spirochetes in their blood

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by Theodore, Feb 16, 2016.

  1. Theodore

    Theodore Senior Member

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    Mats Lindström, relative
    Titti Alvarsson, biomedical analyst, Dalapraktiken
    Published February 14, 2016
    Stockholm, SWEDEN


    Abstract
    PURPOSE: The purpose of this study is to investigate whether chronically ill people without known biomarkers (n=40), may have abnormalities in their blood compared to healthy people (n=5).

    MATERIALS AND METHODS:
    Venous blood is centrifuged to separate plasma and blood cells. The liquid in the area between the plasma and blood cells is sucked up with a pipette. Then it is centrifuged again and finally applied to a glass lens for microscope (dark field), 800 x magnification.

    A diagnostic checklist was used with 75 (77 in swedish) questions of symptoms. At least 20 positive answers are believed to increase an active Lyme infection, except in cases erythema migrans occurs (can often sole basis for diagnosis).

    RESULTS: In the group of chronically ill were spirochetes detected in the blood of 32 patients (80%) of the 40. None of the healthy subjects showed any abnormalities in the blood. Of the participants, 31 had diagnosis ME/CFS. Spirochetes were detected in the blood of 27 patients (87%).

    CONCLUSION: Spirochetes are very common in some group of patients, especially with diagnosis ME/CFS.

    https://newsaboutdisease.wordpress....onically-ill-have-spirochetes-in-their-blood/
     
    taniaaust1, justy, jepps and 7 others like this.
  2. deleder2k

    deleder2k Senior Member

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    Is this a real study or not? It doesn't look like it has been published anywhere
     
    Esther12 likes this.
  3. Theodore

    Theodore Senior Member

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  4. mango

    mango Senior Member

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    nooo, it is not a real study! :bang-head:
     
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  5. mango

    mango Senior Member

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    if you read the blog, you'll quickly realise it's just one person's speculations... this person is very controversial in Sweden... has no medical background at all... his wife is suffering from ME, so he desperately wants to help. definitely not to be taken seriously! it's just a personal blog, pretending to be something that it isn't...
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
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  6. Theodore

    Theodore Senior Member

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    Okey...I am sorry for having posted it then.

    If I understand well Mats Lindström is the husband and Titti Alvarsson the one in charge of this "study"?

    Edit : Titti Alvarsson is indeed the one who performed the "study", is he also controversial?
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
    Esther12 likes this.
  7. mango

    mango Senior Member

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    of course it's okay to post it. maybe best not to place it here in the scientific category, though?

    i really hope people read the fine print, the disclaimers... might be very misleading otherwise, like for example if people mistakenly believe it's a proper scientific study that has been registered and approved, reviewed, published, designed by people with medical knowledge and training in methodology etc...
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
  8. sarah darwins

    sarah darwins I told you I was ill

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    I think he's a she!
     
  9. Theodore

    Theodore Senior Member

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    you're right, he is a she!
     
  10. mango

    mango Senior Member

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    I don't know anything about Titti, have no reason to doubt her. She did the bloodtest/analysis part, yes.

    I'm sorry if I'm too harsh!
     
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  11. deleder2k

    deleder2k Senior Member

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    Ninan likes this.
  12. Kina

    Kina

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    This thread has been moved to the 'Other Health News and Research' forum. Thank you. :):):)
     
  13. msf

    msf Senior Member

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    Why don´t we invite @matsli to explain this?
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
  14. Theodore

    Theodore Senior Member

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    What a good idea msf!
     
  15. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards "Gibberish"

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    I always like to take things like this seriously until proved otherwise. What I found intriguing was the video of a 'spirochaete' found in one of the patients' blood. If finding these is so easy what have all the big hospital labs been doing wrong? The video seems to show some sort of long thin moving animate line. But the online videos of Borrelia burgwhatsit show corkscrew lines corkscrewing. So what was the line in the video in this 'study'? Was it Borrelia nonburgthingamy? I am prepared to accept any convincing explanation. Seriously, actually.
     
  16. Antares in NYC

    Antares in NYC Senior Member

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    Dr. Edwards, the video and photos of spirochetes in that blog look consistent with microscopy images of borrelia (not just borrelia burgdorferi, but with many other variations of that bug). While they have a corkscrew shape, they look like shakey squiggly worms under the microscope. Disgusting actually:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=borrelia microscopy






    Not sure how serious or strict this study is, but if their results are to be believed, they may be on to something. It's also not the first time I read similar reports from scandinavian countries. It may be the case that borrelia (in all its many variations) is more ubiquitous than we thought, especially since testing is quite unreliable.

    Just my two cents.
     
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  17. barbc56

    barbc56 Senior Member

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    Maybe he and she used Live Cell Analysis where you can find anything and everything including Waldo?

    ETA changed like to live.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
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  18. Asa

    Asa Senior Member

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    The following seems fair enough:

    From the Swedish summary: "Jag kan inte styrka att det är borrelia man ser. Men undersökningens resultat kan tyckas vara av så stort allmänintresse och folkhälsointresse att den bör följas upp."

    Google translate: "I can not prove that it is Lyme disease [that is] seen. But the survey results may appear to be of such great public interest and public health interest that it should be followed up."
     
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  19. Asa

    Asa Senior Member

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    Also under Discussion: "Den första borreliaspiroketen upptäcktes genom mikroskopi Varför är mikroskopi inte en accepterad metod att diagnosticera borrelia i kombination med en klinisk undersökning? Metoden kan knappast vara sämre än PCR och ELISA."

    "The first Lyme spirochete was detected by microscopy Why is microscopy is not an accepted method of diagnosing Lyme disease in combination with the clinical examination ? The method can hardly be worse than the PCR and ELISA."

    Seems to be a thoughtful public-health question.

    [Edit:] Makes me think (wonder/suspect) that the authors (as so many others) have (likely) asked and asked and asked and asked and asked -- and have been ignored -- and have asked and asked and asked and asked, ad nauseum and until they're blue in the face, as the saying goes. And so now, they're screaming: Hey! LOOK at this! What is THIS then?!
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
    justy, Justin30, sebreg and 2 others like this.
  20. Gijs

    Gijs Senior Member

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    When i see the video it looks if i see the universe and falling stars :) This is not an accepted method. Unfortenately.
     
    Kati likes this.

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