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23andMe says: +/+ MTHFR C677T and CBS issues???

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Sherpa, Oct 28, 2014.

  1. Sherpa

    Sherpa Ex-workaholic adrenaline junkie

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    I finally got my 23andMe results back:

    +/+ : MTHFR C677T, VDR Taq, MAO-A R297R, MTR A2756G, MTRR A66G, SOD2 A16V, CYP2D6 S486T
    +/- : MTRR A664A, BHMT-02, BHMT-08, CBS A360A


    What I have interpreted, with help from the SNP Guide by @caledonia :

    First priority
    CBS A360A hetero with BHMT-02 & 08 hereto. Do I need to do a sulfur diet before methylation will work?

    The interpretation guide says "You only have to treat for CBS if it's expressed... Signs are having trouble with tolerating sulfur foods (MAYBE. I prefer non-sulfury veggies, but no obvious reaction), having trouble tolerating methyl supplements such as methylfolate (YES) and methylcobalmin no matter how small the dose. Classic symptoms are a stress/anxiety reaction (YES. I get GERD)... tight painful trapezius muscles (YES, that spot in particular hurt on methylfolate!) and so on.

    Second Priority:
    MTHFR C677T: This means I have 70-80% decreased functioning in folate conversion and metabolism. Probably need methylfolate supplementation.

    MAO-A R297R may explain my OCD. MTR and MTRR may explain why I am B12 deficient. CYP2D6 may explain why I never felt good taking the SSRI and tricyclics.

    ---------

    My main point of confusion is that my results suggest I need methylfolate (C667T), but when I took a methylfolate-containing multivitamin I experienced too much excitiotoxicity & insomnia. Is this because of CBS or another factor (too high Bs / minerals in the multivitamin or some other SNP genetic reaction)?

    If anyone else has any insight into my SNPs and any hidden story they tell, I would deeply appreciate it!
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2014
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  2. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

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    I cant answer your questions (Im feeling brain dead which dont help) thou I do have the same mutations.

    What I did want to say that I my CBS mutation wasnt originally expressing itself then one day suddenly started too and ever since then eggs can make me feel sick (it was a very mild unwellness feel, one I wasnt completely sure about at first).. and then and lots of brocolli which I 'd previously been okay with, started giving me a stomach aches. I worked out I had a CBS mutation from those symptoms even before I had the 23andME test done.

    I have heard it said that it is important to treat the CBS mutation first. My MTHFR mutation specialist thou, he just has focused on the MTHFR (i dont know if he knows about CBS stuff). I was slowly getting better (more stamina etc) while following his MTHFR protocol so for me treating that certain helps (before I got put into a situation where Im almost constantly over doing things so now my health is worsening for that reason).

    My MTHFR mutation specialist has me taking a bioactive form of folic acid called folinic acid (calicum folinate) .. he specified a certain brand "source naturals" "MegaFolinic" which he has me taking with high potency methylcobalmin B12 by "natural factors" which he has me take under my tongue. Those are what he's found helps people best with this (but his procotol Ive noticed does vary from some others).

    I dont know what one is supposed to do with this mutation if one cant tolerate methyl groups.. I personally seem to be fine with them but maybe you can consider trying the bioactive form of folate called Folinic acid seeing you cant tolerate the methyl form.

    You probably could get some good advice from the MTHFR webside.
     
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  3. sregan

    sregan Senior Member

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    Your MTR and MTRR mean you probably don't recycle B12 so good (MTRR) and when you get some you use it up faster than normal (MTR). So you'll probably need more B12 than your average rabbit. VDR Taq you might check your vitamin D levels and supplement if low. The MAO means you probably process Serotonin at a slower rate than everyone else so you're probably full of that. I don't think that would be the cause of OCD since the preferred treatment is boosting Serotonin with SSRI's. You might need to be careful with anything that should boost Serotonin.

    SO between your MTHFR (http://mthfr.net/mthfr-c677t-mutation-basic-protocol/2012/02/24/) and your MTR and MTRR your methylation is probably operating very sub optimally.

    On the positive side you don't have any COMT issues and your CBS is only a +/-. So you should be ok with Methyl B12 and probably ok with sulfur.
     
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  4. sregan

    sregan Senior Member

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    Someone else can chime in here also but I think you need to be careful with Folinic Acid also. Folic Acid is definitely a no no. A lot of people here can also get methyl-trapped from folinic acid just as easily as folic acid. Safest to take Methyl Folate.
     
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  5. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

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    Thanks sregan, I have the same mutations as the threads poster and what you said about MAO and serotonin I didnt know. I react badly to SSRIs but had assumed it was due to the other mutation I have which affects those, I once reacted very terribly to St Johns Wort too.
    ..................

    Sherpa. I forgot to say that I had hair testing done and from that I found out I had copper levels so high they were off the graph! I also were severely deficient in molybdenum (which is an essential trace mineral) on hair tests. So finding out I had a CBS mutation, helped me make sense of those. (You may want to consider a hair test to find out if your CBS mutation has affected you in those ways).

    With supplemention of molybdenum, it helped me greatly after only 5 days supplementation of it, I went from not being able to do maths in my head for years, to being able to do it in my head again some. Amazing change for me.
     
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  6. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

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    What do they recommend for those who cant take methyl groups such as the poster?
     
  7. Sherpa

    Sherpa Ex-workaholic adrenaline junkie

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    @taniaaust1 interesting that we have almost the same mutations! :) Yes, I have ordered a hair test already and will mail it off tomorrow. Interesting that you had copper toxicity.

    As far as why I reacted so strongly to methylfolate in a multivitamin:

    Possible explanation #1) I have CBS sulfur issues that impair methylation. I must lower sulfur and try again.

    Explanation #2) Maybe the Methylfolate containing Multivatmin I was taking was just too strong overall. Maybe it wasn't the methylfolate that caused the bad reaction. Perhaps too many Bs triggered a detox, too much of one particular mineral in the blend my body didn't like, or too much in synergy. I could try again by isolating and adding just Metafolin or Folinic (as @taniaaust1 's Dr. recommended).

    Explanation #3) The methylfolate indeed caused my insomnia / excitotoxicity. I need methylfolate but it does some kind of detox or awakening reaction that is very powerful. I have to microtitrate it up. Or I need some kind of cofactor.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2014
  8. PeterPositive

    PeterPositive Senior Member

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    I have the same C677T problem along with MTR/MTRR issues.
    My main suggestion would be... easy with the Bs. :D
    Take your time with them. Start from low dosages and find a safe amount that doesn't cause any problem. Then be patient and up the dose every 1-2 weeks depending on how you respond to them.

    It has taken me a long time to build my dosages and every time I rushed the process I didn't enjoy it :)

    I know... boring suggestions, nothing too exciting. But in the end it works. If you rush through the protocol you'll likely get bad side effects, be scared and quit it.

    cheers
     
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  9. Sherpa

    Sherpa Ex-workaholic adrenaline junkie

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    Great insight @PeterPositive!

    I have gone down to 1 Yasko's All-in-One in the A.M (very low Bs) And one Nature Made B Complex that @Freddd recommends in the P.M. (low Bs). I feel calmer and can sleep.

    Perhaps adding some Folinic or Metafolin with less Bs in the mix will have a different reaction.
     
  10. caledonia

    caledonia

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    One of my suggestions would be to do testing for CBS. The Heartfixer page has good info on that, but basically you look at ammonia and urine sulfate. Most people just end up getting urine sulfate strips as a "poor man's" CBS test.

    My other suggestion would be to go a lot lower and see if that helps. I'm currently taking 1/64 of one Yasko All In One only two days a week as I'm getting side effects from metal detox - that's low!

    See my other documents Start Low and Go Slow and Roadblocks to Successful Methylation for more help (linked in my signature below).
     
  11. sregan

    sregan Senior Member

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    I don't think there is a sub for methyl folate. There is HCBL instead of MCBL for B12.
     

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