inner ear inflammation, made worse by honey

[boolybooly]

Would be grateful for any insight which can help to reduce inflammation which is currently making me deaf in my right ear.

Ever since ME CFIDS onset in '86 I have had regular recurrent viruses all year round and very severe allergies especially in the June-July grass pollen season coupled to an increased tendency to cysts and zits about that time too.

In several recent summers I have had bad nasal polyps and cold like symptoms and found they got a lot worse when I tried a honey drink (edit : I believe due to salicylates in honey). I discovered the antihistamine I was taking, Loratidine, has a side effect of increased infection in upper respiratory tract. So I believe I had a recurring virus in my nose activated due to the Loratidine+immune crisis which precipitated mucosa inflammation, made worse by salicylates. So I recognised the need to cut out salicylates during a cold. I can eat salicylates just fine most of the year.

This year I stopped using Loratidine and tried turmeric and cloves and did not get a nasal cold or polyps and my hayfever was manageable. So I thought I was in the clear and forgot about the salicylates. When I got an inner ear infection I assumed it was not the same kind of situation, so I tried honey again and it immediately got a lot worse like previous years with my nose and my inner ear is now pressurised and I cannot hear anything with that ear. So I think it must be another virus and I do sometimes get recurring bouts of some kind of vertigo inducing virus and had a nasty cold earlier this summer so it could be one of those or another one.

My question is what can help to reduce infection associated inflammation. I have been to see my doctor and been prescribed beclomethasone nasal spray and I am using it. The ear is not congested and the eustachian tube is clear without gunge, the swelling is deep inside, but I was prescribed menthol and eucalyptus decongestant, which seems a bit generic but there you go. I am trying it but it does not seem to have any relation to the problem, which I believe is caused by membrane inflammation and swelling as in my nose, pressing on my ear bones and preventing the transmission of sound, also possibly squeezing the nerve. I am getting some strange neurological crossover effects where there is a buzz in the deaf ear when the working ear hears sound.

I have begun salicylate elimination in my diet and also taking cysteine, glucosamine sulphate, glycine (jelly) and B vits especially B3 to support salicylate removal. But the nasal polyps typically took months to reduce so I am expecting this to take a while too.

Does this ring a bell for anyone? Any ideas how this kind of inflammation can be reduced with herbs, supplements or diet?

 

[Richard7]

Ok @boolybooly I cannot say I have the answer but I may have an answer.

I have spent much of this year working on sinus and nasopharyngeal inflammation. I have found that the swelling and shrinking of my sinuses (presumably) seems to lead to a lot of movement in my face and have had problems with ear ache and sinus pain for most if not all of the last 14 years (the time I have had ME/CFS)

I noticed that my inflammation (particularly a warm sensation behind the eyes) was made much worse by dates and most other dried fruit, honey and things that contained sugar like ice cream or chocolate, or once smooth peanut butter on slices of apple (I had no idea that someone could sell something with 10% sugar as peanut butter).

So the sensitivity to honey is familiar. And I suggest that you might want to treat it like a potential fungal/bacterial infection.

I understand that most chronic sinus infections are caused by fungal infections that modify the sinus environment to make it hospitable to bacteria. So if I was starting at the begining again I would try to get some nystatin 500,000 iu capsules ad use half in the morning and half in the evening mixed with saline (1 tsp salt to 500ml boilled water - then cooled before use) in a sinus rinse. Nystatin is a powder, it will not dissolve but be a suspension. Your sinuses produce about 500ml of mucos over the day and it is my hope that nilstat particles will slowly be carried down with that mucos and get wherever it needs to get.

I though I was about to do something odd when I came up with this idea, but when I searched for it I found others (on this forum) had been there before me, one even used the oral suspension because (s)he could not get a script for the capsules.

The menthol and eucalyptus should work as antimicrobials, I have used vicks ( placed between upper lip and nostrils overnight). If that was not enough look at l. sakei. I felt that taking l. sakei seemed to make thing better and worse, lots of shifting in my face as my sinus inflammation went up and down. I think the problem was that the kind I was getting came with glucose and I had not yet used nystatin so was probably feeding whatever fungi were the root of the problem.

Then I am not sure. If all was OK and money was tight that may be enough. But I found dental probiotics to be good and see value in Osamu Hotta's protocol as well.

The dental probiotics would presumably work by reseading a good population.

Dr Osamu Hotta's protocol is about swabbilng the nasopharynx and back of the throat with 0.5% zinc chloride solution. The idea is to ablate the area (remove infected skin cells) and encourage the growth of new healthy skin cells. I followed it carefully for about 100 days with much improvement but without being able to get to more that 2 days without any blood on the swabs. I have followed it a little less consistently for the last 6 wks and have only had the barest trace of blood on 2 of the last 7 days (last weekend). If I can get to 7 days of swabbing without blood I will stop.

 

[boolybooly]

Maybe I can help you @Richard7 . I should have said in my OP that honey has salicylates in it (as do a lot of vegetables and nuts) and this can cause pseudoanaphylaxis, nasal polyps etc in people with this sensitivity. So that is a transient hypersensitivity for me for some reason. I still get the swelling even when I dont eat them, they just make it much worse.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salicylate_sensitivity

Salicylates might explain your symptoms too actually. Dates are high in salicylates, all dried fruits are high, peanuts in skins are high, even plain peanut butters are medium.

http://salicylatesensitivity.com/about/food-guide/fruits/
http://salicylatesensitivity.com/about/food-guide/nuts-seeds/

Check the index at the top of linked pages above for other food types.

Salicylates are eliminated by sulphate / sulfate transfer to the phenolic ring at their core enabling their excretion via the enzyme Phenol-Sulfotransferase. So it follows that sulphate in your diet helps, as does alkalinity like bicarb which favours excretion in the urine.
http://healthyawareness.com/phenol-sulfotransferase-pst-and-the-feingold-diet/

The liver can also use glutathione to get rid of salicylates which can be assisted with cysteine foods and supps (eg garlic). Glutathione is also synthesised using glycine which is high in glycerine containing foods ie jelly, as well as glutamate which is fairly common in foods.

It crosses my mind to say that the benefit of zinc may be in supplementation rather than antimicrobial.

 

[IThinkImTurningJapanese]

Any ideas how this kind of inflammation can be reduced with herbs, supplements or diet?

I have found considerable relief from iFlora as described here.

It's not perfect, while I was suffering from the Flu it was only able to reduce the problem, but otherwise it has eliminated a recurring problem with itchiness and inflammation in my ears.

 

[boolybooly]

Thanks @IThinkImTurningJapanese I will certainly take another look at probiotics. The same brand is on Amazon.co.uk.

The strange thing is my predisposition to inflammation only occurs in one season, summer, when the grass pollen is out. I have been very allergic to grass pollen, severely in the first decade of ME CFIDS and slowly attenuating.

My pollen allergy has been very mild this year, though present. The inflammation has always been a feature, it used to be my eyelids. This year it is severe and has been for several years now though previously in my nose. Its almost as if the inflammation is replacing the itching eyes and sneezing and so on as the main expression of the allergy, but the inflammation is also acting like a viral episode, either a head cold or in this case inner ear virus.

So its almost as if my allergy to pollen makes me prone to virus recurrence and the virus(es) then cause(s) excessive inflammation. Its kind of scary, because if it gets out of hand, like anaphylaxis, it could be potentially dangerous but I cannot find any way to treat it. Mild steroids seem ineffectual, all I can do is sit it out and as the virus is defeated and cleared the inflammation decreases.

 

[boolybooly]

I think I may have found out what triggered this problem for me, in short coconut oil is bad for ME CFIDS.

I made a thread to report the research paper I found.

https://forums.phoenixrising.me/ind...plicated-in-proinflammatory-activation.61254/

Basically they think coconut medium chain triglycerides can favour anaphylaxis by boosting TH2 responses, which is the opposite direction to the one that ME CFIDS people want to go in. A wellregarded theory with some substantiation is that CFIDS PWME are TH2 shifted and this is part of the problem.

This matches my responses as above as a few years ago I started trying to boost coconut oil in my diet and that was when the trouble with unexpectedly severe oedemas started.

 

[boolybooly]

And now I have blogged it FYI. (edit- I should add that I stopped eating coconut based on the coincidence of the timing of starting to eat it and the onset of the oedemas plus a hunch. I stopped around last winter and this year I have had no oedema episodes... touch wood.)

Coconut - the downside for ME CFIDS patients - possible TH2 shifting.

https://boolyblog.blogspot.com/

 

[Mel9]

And now I have blogged it FYI. (edit- I should add that I stopped eating coconut based on the coincidence of the timing of starting to eat it and the onset of the oedemas plus a hunch. I stopped around last winter and this year I have had no oedema episodes... touch wood.)


https://boolyblog.blogspot.com/

Very interesting @boolybooly .

Is it still working?

I have had sinus and nasal polyps for years. After a long course of nystatin, I accidentally stopped using coconut oil on my skin a month ago.

I ran out of claratyne this week and find that I no longer need it. (But maybe a councidence?)

 

[boolybooly]

Hi @Mel9 yep. No coconut no oedemas.

Though the oedemas were always limited to June-July for me as that is the period when I have historically been most TH2 shifted every year since 1986 as mentioned above. So that was ongoing and the coconut escalated the inflammation I always got, at that time of year, to an alarming degree.

This year it didnt and I will see how it goes next year, but so far so good. Its a bit scary though to think I have to eat carefully now to get next year right, though I have also been having problems with ongoing food intolerance headaches and I am hoping I might be able to make progress with those, if they are related. I think there is something going on with lectins with those though, at least with some of the foods anyway.

For you, not sure if its wise but there is obviously one way to check. But it does not seem wise to muck about with potential anaphylaxis so I cannot recommend testing it imho and am not going to test myself again either, as I am already convinced.

I really dont know the answer in the case of skin absorption.

The hypothetical mechanism in the paper suggests it is something to do with the Peyer's patches, because the investigators say MCT enhanced antigen absorbtion into the patches in the gut and blocked it in the blood. But these patches are an extension of the lymphatic system and the lymphatic system is extensive and occurs under the skin as well, it does seem possible that MCT has the same effect there, enhancing antigen absorbtion but its all very speculative.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3563838/?report=classic

 

[boolybooly]

Update on this, after sticking to a diet reducing intake of medium chain triglycerides by avoiding coconut, palm oil and dairy, I am free of oedema this year, as last year when I started on this diet management strategy, unlike the previous two years.

I still seem to react adversely to grass pollen but not nearly as strongly. Which is why I believe avoiding MCT reduces the "amplification" of the inflammatory signalling system somehow and conversely eating MCTs "amplifies" allergic responses.

I have also taken steps to improve histamine management and cook high lectin foods more thoroughly, as lectins are also allergens and have been causing headaches for me. I believe I have fairly classic post EBV CFIDS type ME and food intolerance and TH2 shift are issues for some ME patients I have read about so I think it is important to tell you folks about this in case it could help some people.

Histamine is a signalling system involved in allergy. As I understand it, TH2 shifted people are more likely to have histamine related symptoms so any additional source or cause of histamine release can tip them over the edge more easily and TH2 shifted people are more likely to experience chronic low level inflammation

On the histamine reduction, I found the supplements listed in the following link very helpful in reducing my headaches, apparently by supporting DAO and HMNT activity. I will quote relevant sections in case the link changes. I have also been taking a DAO supplement with some foods known to be high in histamine.

Histamine intolerance: Causes, symptoms, and test

Factors that lead to histamine intolerance cause the following:

• An increase in how much histamine a person's digestion releases.
• A decrease in the effectiveness or abundance of diamine oxidase, or DAO, the primary enzyme that breaks down ingested histamine.
• A decrease in the effectiveness or abundance of histamine-N-methyltransferase, or HNMT, an enzyme that helps break down histamine within cells.

Vitamins and minerals that may be good for people with histamine intolerance include:

• vitamin B-6, which helps DAO break down histamine
• vitamin C to help lower histamine blood levels and help DAO break down histamine
• copper, which helps raise DAO blood levels slightly and helps DAO break down histamine
• magnesium that can raise the allergic response threshold
• manganese that can enhance DAO activity
• zinc to help DAO break down histamine (it may also have anti-inflammatory and anti-allergic properties)
• calcium to help reduce hives and skin flushing
• vitamin B-1
• vitamin B-12
• folic acid