Brain MRI for ME Patients?

[SueJohnPat]

I had an Mri 2 years ago in febuary. My neuro symptoms were so bad I hired a nurse to go to the doctor ( neurologist) with me. Had eeg and mri done which was '" normal for my age". Dr sounded defensive, he would only offer testing at all after I named dropped a Prominent doctor there who is a relative.
I told him I had cfs. I think he was not a bad doctor just felt very frustrated that he could do nothing to help me.


He did think it was stress but I can't say I blame him because I bursts into tears in his office.
Neuro quant offers an analysis of an mri for " mold". I did not have it done.
Spect scans do show abnormalities but I guess they are expensive. (Sigh)

I have since gotten much better through " mold avoidance". My symptoms always got bad during the fall and winter.I have since done a mold sabbatical remediated some mold we had in the basement took cholestyramine get better.
But I believe I am in a bad area from " mystery" toxin.

 

[TrixieStix]

And even with a SPECT scan my understanding is thelat qt least some of abnormalities can come and go.


In one study I read about researchers found that on one day a whole side of a patients brain would be look abnormal in terms of function but another day the same patient's scan would look perfectly normal.

 

[ScottTriGuy]

My MRI from a few years ago found an "effaced sella" which turns out to be 'empty sella syndrome':

"a condition in which the pituitary gland shrinks or becomes flattened."

https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/000349.htm

 

[arewenearlythereyet]

I was tested for MS (my very first test...such happy memories). They only did the neck though since they were looking for a reason for my fatigue and numb hands and feet. They also did nerve conductivity tests. Both came back normal but still can't turn pages of books\drop slippery things. Hope you are not claustraphobic and if you are sensitive to noise, I suggets you take them up on the ear plugs. I stupidly thought I was going in for a CT scan so wasn't worried until they hauled me in. Keep your eyes shut is my advice.

 

[Neunistiva]

I had several MRIs, with progressively stronger magnets. They found asymptomatic cyst, removed it, and now everything is fine. There was no change in my symptoms.

I think MS only sounds like ME/CFS if you describe symptoms very broadly, such as: cognitive issues, bladder issues,... But if you describe those issues in detail instead, like so: deficits in visual-spatial abilities, emotional instability, incontinence, it really doesn't sound like ME/CFS at all.

 

[Old Bones]

I think MS only sounds like ME/CFS if you describe symptoms very broadly, such as: cognitive issues, bladder issues,... But if you describe those issues in detail instead, like so: deficits in visual-spatial abilities, . . . it really doesn't sound like ME/CFS at all.

@Neunistiva By this do you mean "deficits in visual-spatial abilities" are more characteristic of MS rather than ME/CFS? This symptom is very typical for me -- especially bad when over-doing things, or when my sleep is more disturbed.

 

[TrixieStix]

@Kenny Banya 's thread (above) contemplating neurologists as the most-ignorant medical specialty when it comes to ME was the incentive for this question.



Like @TrixieStix , I will be having a brain MRI next year to determine if there is another explanation (MS was suggested) for my worsening neurological symptoms. Perhaps I will be fortunate in avoiding a similar horror story to those recounted in Kenny's thread about neurologists, since my MRI has been ordered by my supportive GP.

I couldn't help myself from "Googling" MS symptoms. I checked "yes" to most of them -- no doubt a common experience for many of us. Just wondering . . . .

How many PR members have had a brain MRI? Was it helpful (i.e. did it show any abnormalities)?

I just took another look at my MRI after Dr. Chheda mentioned the "findings" at my appt with her earlier this month. When I said "normal" in that msg you quoted I was parroting what the MS doc told me. That in someone my age mid-30's and who has migraines that the 2 abnormal areas of increased signal they found could be explained by the migraines. So not exactly "normal" but rather they weren't worried about them. I did some reading the other night and while they have found that a large % of migraine sufferers do show these brain changes on MRI they don't know what effects these brain changes may have on a person or if they put someone at higher risk for other problems later in life, etc. And also they cannot be certain that the migraines are to blame for the brain abnormalities or not.

 

[Old Bones]

Here are the results for last month's brain MRI, for those who may be interested. My GP (the doctor who requisitioned the test) said she has absolutely no idea how to interpret the report. It states:

• nonspecific prior microhemorrhages are noted in the left anterior temporal lobe and left cerebellum, the distribution atypical for hypertension or prior trauma
• given the relatively young patient age, the appearance would also be atypical for cerebral amyloid angiopathy
• scattered tiny subcentimeter foci of white matter signal hyperintensity may reflect microangiopathic change ???
• minimal scattered mucosal thickening in the paranasal sinuses
• generalized brain parenchymal volume loss not significant
• the globes, orbits, regional osseous and soft tissue structures are unremarkable

This article ( https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3881231/ ) states that:

"Cerebral microbleeds (also called cerebral microhemorrhages) are small, punctuate hypointense lesions . . . They occur in the setting of impaired small vessel integrity, commonly due to either hypertensive vasculopathy or cerebral amyloid angiopathy." (both causes ruled out for me, as stated above)

So, it seems my results were consistent with @Countrygirl 's "hyperintense foci", plus @-Jessie- 's and @PatJ 's frontal lobe lesions. Like other responders on this thread (Thanks!), MS has been ruled out. Also, thanks @arewenearlythereyet for your advice to keep my eyes shut. It really helped.

Although it is interesting to have proof of the punctate lesions I've read occur in ME patients, the only other information I've gleaned is that I am both atypical, and unremarkable. And isn't that how many medical personnel perceive their ME patients?

Are there any other interpretations I could consider from the reported results?

 

[TigerLilea]

Although it is interesting to have proof of the punctate lesions I've read occur in ME patients, the only other information I've gleaned is that I am both atypical, and unremarkable. And isn't that how many medical personnel perceive their ME patients?

Are there any other interpretations I could consider from the reported results?

A friend of mine had a MRI done a few years ago on her carotid artery, and even though that checked out fine, the MRI picked up a small brain tumour. However. The brain tumour is so small that she was told in all likelihood it will turn out to never be an issue. That is the problem with MRIs. They pick up every little thing and show things that we would probably never know about and will never ever be a health issue for us if we lived to be a hundred.

 

[edawg81]

My Dr is trying to get an MRI, I'm trying to see if this research may be helpful (even though its a few years old), I'll post if the results are of any significance:

Right Arcuate Fasciculus Abnormality in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

http://pubs.rsna.org/doi/abs/10.1148/radiol.14141079

https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-n...bnormalities-in-chronic-fatigue-patients.html

 

[arewenearlythereyet]

Here are the results for last month's brain MRI, for those who may be interested. My GP (the doctor who requisitioned the test) said she has absolutely no idea how to interpret the report. It states:

• nonspecific prior microhemorrhages are noted in the left anterior temporal lobe and left cerebellum, the distribution atypical for hypertension or prior trauma
• given the relatively young patient age, the appearance would also be atypical for cerebral amyloid angiopathy
• scattered tiny subcentimeter foci of white matter signal hyperintensity may reflect microangiopathic change ???
• minimal scattered mucosal thickening in the paranasal sinuses
• generalized brain parenchymal volume loss not significant
• the globes, orbits, regional osseous and soft tissue structures are unremarkable

This article ( https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3881231/ ) states that:

"Cerebral microbleeds (also called cerebral microhemorrhages) are small, punctuate hypointense lesions . . . They occur in the setting of impaired small vessel integrity, commonly due to either hypertensive vasculopathy or cerebral amyloid angiopathy." (both causes ruled out for me, as stated above)

So, it seems my results were consistent with @Countrygirl 's "hyperintense foci", plus @-Jessie- 's and @PatJ 's frontal lobe lesions. Like other responders on this thread (Thanks!), MS has been ruled out. Also, thanks @arewenearlythereyet for your advice to keep my eyes shut. It really helped.

Although it is interesting to have proof of the punctate lesions I've read occur in ME patients, the only other information I've gleaned is that I am both atypical, and unremarkable. And isn't that how many medical personnel perceive their ME patients?

Are there any other interpretations I could consider from the reported results?

Glad you survived the sliding coffin @Old Bones . I can't help with interpretation but I guess what I would like to know in your place is what the micro bleeds were typical of? How common are they etc? I think these are legitimate questions to ask if you haven't already. It might be like broken capillaries that you see on the surface of the skin or minor everyday bruises etc and totally harmless. It would help to follow up to get context to the results. Good news about the MS though.