Clostridium Butyricum - A Game Changer?

[Sidereal]

@Sidereal Is that because the probiotic / prebiotic is boosting immmunity or suppressing it?

Boosting immunity. In general, everything that tends to be anti-inflammatory in normal people or people with regular diseases tends to be massively inflammatory for me.

 

[Biarritz13]

I've been taking AOR probiotic-3 for a couple of weeks. I have had a lot of extra energy and improved mood. I often tend towards diarrhoea but with the AOR I have firm stool.

All in all it's a game changer for me. I'm shocked at the difference. The improvement was almost immediate.

The instructions say to take it between meals but I usually take it with food. What's everyone else doing?

Someone else reported this on iherb:

"I also learned about AOR from Animal Pharm. I have been taking these since August. I also take Threelac and beta glucan. But this one was the first I took that changed my health dramatically. I have celiacs disease and have always had fatigue issues- even as a kid. I tried everything for the past 2 years to boost energy and nothing really worked. I decided to take this probiotic figuring it was good for me since I have celiacs disease. I was not taking this as a cure to my fatigue, but to my surprise by the time I finished the first bottle, my brain turned on!! And out of nowhere I had energy!"

 

[Abha]

I got standard delivery from US Amazon to Ireland. Delivery was ridiculously cheap, like 2 euro. It shipped from Japan and arrived surprisingly fast, less than a week if I recall correctly. Ordering stuff from UK Amazon has no advantage in situations such as this where it's being shipped from an outside vendor anyway. My UK Amazon log in details and all the stored CC information worked with US Amazon.

Hi sidereal....I have looked at wiredream costs for shipping to uk...22£ if I wish to order.The Amazon US site only puts expedited delivery(no choice)...no mention of standard delivery.Did you have that problem and if so how did you overcome it?
I have just found this thread and find it very interesting......I don't use this site so much nowadays....I take potato starch and the CB may be beneficial for me too.

 

[Sidereal]

Hi sidereal....I have looked at wiredream costs for shipping to uk...22£ if I wish to order.The Amazon US site only puts expedited delivery(no choice)...no mention of standard delivery.Did you have that problem and if so how did you overcome it?
I have just found this thread and find it very interesting......I don't use this site so much nowadays....I take potato starch and the CB may be beneficial for me too.

Hi Abha, I ordered it over a year ago so I don't think the prices then are relevant as they tend to change quite frequently. I'm just looking at Amazon UK site and it says free delivery to the UK.

 

[Abha]

Hi Abha, I ordered it over a year ago so I don't think the prices then are relevant as they tend to change quite frequently. I'm just looking at Amazon UK site and it says free delivery to the UK.

Hi Sidereal....Thanks for that.I ordered it on EBay.On further reading of this thread i see some have had problems so hopefully I can avoid those....

 

[outdamnspot]

I know it's hard to ascertain much after a single dose, but I've become extremely sensitive to supplements and tend to experience 'crashes' very easily .. usually manifesting as a kind of endless hunger and inability to feel full (plus hypoglycemia, prior to switching to Keto).

I did take one dose of Miyarisin this morning on an empty stomach; it's hard to differentiate between having an actual appetite and my 'crash' hunger .. but I did feel really hungry afterwards, and it's continued all day.

I've also felt less adrenaline-y, but more malaised, brain-fogged and depressed all day.

Supplementing Sodium Butyrate directly was bad for more sugar levels; not sure if increasing it indirectly with Miyarisin will be different.

Wondering if I should persist with it ..

 

[tango]

The AOR has been a game changer for me iwhereas resistant starch and taking extra butter etc for butyrate production had been of limited value. It encourages me to find something helpful although it's only one piece of the puzzle.

I found an interesting study on the microbiome of people with CFS and it all seems to fit together

 

[tango]

Here's the study:
http://www.cfstreatmentguide.com/blog/all-in-your-gut
Check out the differences in types and diversity of gut bacteria including clostridium which is in AOR

Original press release: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/06/160627160939.htm

 

[Avengers26]

@tango What differences has AOR made for you? I have taken it here & there but never consistently. I might just change that. How much did you take & for how long before you saw the results?

 

[tango]

At least 3x a day and noticed a small lift in mood and energy in the first week. I take up to 6 a day

 

[actup]

As a result of this thread I started using Miyarisan six weeks ago. I love the stuff. I have IBS-d and for the first time in many years know what a normal bm looks like. Initially I had lots of stomach growling which decreases with time. It took care of my bloating and improved food tolerances.

I am trying to get my son with CFS and IBS-c to try it. The trick is to use it consistently three times per day. I do 5 pills per dose. Will give the regimen more time to see how it affects energy level and report back. This has definitely had more effect than any other probiotic I've used. I don't use prebiotics other than my green bananas twice a day. I so appreciate these thoughtful and intelligent threads. Thanks PR.

Btw, I take it with food.

 

[tango]

I think prebiotic can be unhelpful if your system has bad bacteria. You need to establish the good bacteria first.

I might look at buying the Miyarisan on eBay and give it a go. AOR is expensive and I'd like to see if there's a difference


I started taking AOR with food to give it prebiotic material to work on. I sometimes take it on an empty stomach as recommended but think it works better with food. The 6x a day is when I take it on an empty stomach as well as with food.

 

[Biarritz13]

I think prebiotic can be unhelpful if your system has bad bacteria. You need to establish the good bacteria first.

It depends on the prebiotic, some don't increase the pathogenic ones

 

[tango]

It depends on the prebiotic, some don't increase the pathogenic ones

Can you please tell us which prebiotic don't increase pathogenic bacteria? (And a source for this info as I've listened to and read a lot on the microbiome and this is an exciting new addition to my knowledge!)

 

[alicec]

Can you please tell us which prebiotic don't increase pathogenic bacteria?

Perhaps we should ask you which prebiotics have been shown to increase pathogenic bacteria and which pathogens in particular?

After all the definition of a prebiotic is usually along the lines of a food ingredient, not digestible by the host, which has a beneficial effect on host health through selective stimulation of the growth and/or activity of members of the gut microbiota.

 

[Biarritz13]

Can you please tell us which prebiotic don't increase pathogenic bacteria? (And a source for this info as I've listened to and read a lot on the microbiome and this is an exciting new addition to my knowledge!)

Sure.

This is what I found :

Handbook of Prebiotics and Probiotics

 

[JPV]

Sure.

This is what I found :

Handbook of Prebiotics and Probiotics

The excerpt you linked to mentions that csFOS feeds "health promoting bacteria" such as Lactobacilli.

Keep in mind that some strains such as Lactobacillus, which are healthy for the general population, are not well tolerated many who suffer from ME/CFS.

 

[adreno]

I believe we have discussed this before. I don't think there are any fermentable fibers that only functions as substrates for beneficial species, no matter what the popular definition of prebiotics is.

 

[alicec]

I don't think there are any fermentable fibers that only functions as substrates for beneficial species, no matter what the popular definition of prebiotics is

I'd still like to see the studies and know which prebiotics feed which pathogens - or are we just dealing with generalisations?

 

[Biarritz13]

The excerpt you linked to mentions that csFOS feeds "health promoting bacteria" such as Lactobacilli.

Keep in mind that some strains such as Lactobacillus, which are healthy for the general population, are not well tolerated many who suffer from ME/CFS.

The l. plantarum and l. acidophilus aren't well tolerated but isn't because the enterococcus and streptococcus are already high and produce lactic acid?