I can now sleep...with this curry

[cigana]

As I posted previously, indian curry allows me to sleep, but only that from British indian restaurants. I tried many many recipes for home-made curry and none of them work, see the discussion here.

I have now found how to replicate a recipe that means I now sleep until about 8am (rather than 3am, which is when I wake without this curry).

I think the key is the emulsification, which takes a long time. This may be explained by this research on emulsified curcumin showing than nano-emulsion curcumin can suppress inflammation via NFkB and MCP-1 inhibition. I have consistently raised MCP-1.

Here's the recipe ("spoon"=dessert spoon):

Stage 1
Large cooking pot.
Lots of onions - about 20-25 medium-large.
Handful of chopped green and red peper.
2/3 tin of tomatoes.
4 spoons fresh garlic and ginger puree (ground up 2/3 ginger and 1/3 garlic cloves in oil).
1/2 small cabbage.
1 carrot
Handful fresh coriander
3 spoons ground tumeric
3-4 spoons ground coriander
3-4 spoons ground cumin
3-4 spoons asafoetida ("hing")
3-4 spoons ground fenugreek seed
3-4 spoons curry powder
3 spoons salt
1/2 litre of vegatable oil
small cup of water

Put all ingredients into the pot (+lid) in the order in which they are listed. Don't worry about mixing or chopping, everything melts down over time.

Cook on a very low heat for about 1-1.5 hours.

Stage 2
Wait for it to cool, then blend very finely.
Put blended mixture back into a large pot, and pour in about the same amount again of water.
Bring to boil and simmer on a lowish heat for about 1-1.5 hours without lid.
You should start to see at some point a reddish oil film forming on the top. If you start to see this take off the stove, put the lid on and wait 2 minutes. Take the lid of and see if you have a layer of reddish oil across the top of the mixture - if you do, you've finished. If not, take the lid off and put it back on the stove and keep checking every 10 minutes or so to see if you get the red film.

Once it's done you can freeze it. Eat a decent bowl any way you like in the evening (eg. boil it up with other vegetables or meat, or eat it straight as a soup).

I hope it helps someone!

EDIT: I also take 500mg of Enhansa. This gives me an extra 1-2 hours sleep (the curry seems to get me more on top)

 

[girlinthesnow]

Thanks @cigana for the recipe, I'll try this for my chronic insomnia, cheers!

 

[Hip]

@cigana
Glad you managed to find the recipe that recreates the soporific effect of Indian restaurant curry.


Just a thought, but have you tried the much more bioavailable Longvida formulation of curcumin? Now Foods do a good value for money supplement called CurcuBrain, which contains 400 mg of Longvida curcumin per capsule. I believe there are studies showing Longvida is around 60 times more absorbable than standard curcumin.

Assuming it is the NF-κB inhibition of curcumin that is allowing you to sleep, you might also consider other NF-κB inhibitors such as the herb shwagandha (Withania somnifera), grape seed extract, or the drug sulfasalazine (a potent NF-κB inhibitor).

 

[cigana]

@cigana
Glad you managed to find the recipe that recreates the soporific effect of Indian restaurant curry.


Just a thought, but have you tried the much more bioavailable Longvida formulation of curcumin? Now Foods do a good value for money supplement called CurcuBrain, which contains 400 mg of Longvida curcumin per capsule. I believe there are studies showing Longvida is around 60 times more absorbable than standard curcumin.

Assuming it is the NF-κB inhibition of curcumin that is allowing you to sleep, you might also consider other NF-κB inhibitors such as the herb shwagandha (Withania somnifera), grape seed extract, or the drug sulfasalazine (a potent NF-κB inhibitor).

Thanks for the link - I will certainly try CurcuBrain.
Unfortunately ashwaganha and grape seed extract have no effect on me, though perhaps I should try higher doses close to bedtime...

 

[snowathlete]

I take mesalazine for UC which is related to sulfalazine. It keeps a lid on my inflammation but I still have a lot. If I miss a dose the inflammation rises noticably.

This led me to try curcumin which didn't work for me. But I am convinced NF-kB is worth limiting. I tried Boswellia which definitely worked for a while. I stopped taking it but plan to try again to confirm if it works or not. Boswellia is cheap and worth trying, just be aware that it is not water soluble so you need capsules with lose powder not tablets or compacted capsules (else they won't do anything but come out how you put them in!)

 

[rosie26]

Glad you sleeping better now @cigana. Thanks for the recipe.

 

[cigana]

I take mesalazine for UC which is related to sulfalazine. It keeps a lid on my inflammation but I still have a lot. If I miss a dose the inflammation rises noticably.

This led me to try curcumin which didn't work for me. But I am convinced NF-kB is worth limiting. I tried Boswellia which definitely worked for a while. I stopped taking it but plan to try again to confirm if it works or not. Boswellia is cheap and worth trying, just be aware that it is not water soluble so you need capsules with lose powder not tablets or compacted capsules (else they won't do anything but come out how you put them in!)

Thanks. Boswellia doesn't help me unfortunately.
Which type of curcumin did you try? I've tried many brands, and only one of them works - the others do nothing, so I think the form is very important.

 

[maryb]

Thanks @cigana for the recipe, I'll try this for my chronic insomnia, cheers!

If I give you my address can you send me some

 

[snowathlete]

Thanks. Boswellia doesn't help me unfortunately.
Which type of curcumin did you try? I've tried many brands, and only one of them works - the others do nothing, so I think the form is very important.

it was a Now brand, a powder in capsules.

 

[Thinktank]

Great find @cigana, i will definitely try your recipe as i've not tried the whole turmeric root yet.

Sometimes i take 500mg Curcumin. (meriva from Thorne is bound to PC for better absorption) whenever i wake up at night, it usually sends me back to sleep within 20 minutes. Besides that it is a great anti-inflammatory for my IBD.
The downside is it makes me really cranky next day so i can't take too much of it.

 

[girlinthesnow]

If I give you my address can you send me some

Certainly I will send you some, curry by post!

 

[Seanko]

@cigana

If it makes you sleep & feel better, do not worry about the science!

PS Hot spices help release endorphins...

 

[Little Bluestem]

("spoon"=dessert spoon)

Would you measure how much your desert spoon holds? I think they might vary.

I'm glad we do not have to chop all of those onions!

 

[cigana]

Would you measure how much your desert spoon holds? I think they might vary.

I'm glad we do not have to chop all of those onions!

I use a semi-heaped spoon, so it's around 15-20ml.

 

[anne_likes_red]

I'm glad we do not have to chop all of those onions!

Unless you don't read the instructions properly....
I'll never get that hour back!

Will report on sleep in due course. Thx @cigana.

 

[anne_likes_red]

Updating. Didn't help me on the nights I tried it.

I've resumed sleeping later anyway, to a more respectable 6am after waking for a few weeks at 4am. I'm fairly sure (tho not 100%) this is unrelated to the short term increase in Indian spices.

Hope it continues to help you cigana!

 

[Hip]

@cigana
Have you considered that the reason you get a good night's sleep from turmeric-containing curry is because turmeric is a natural antihistamine? Antihistamines can help induce sleep.

 

[Richard7]

would your 20 -25 onions be 4-5 kilos or 8.8-10 lbs?

I know in Australia a dessert spoon is 25mls and internationally its 20mls, so I assume you are saying 60-80mls of hing, or about a quater to a third of a cup, is that right.

I'm, I hope obviously, asking because I am interested, though I expect I will start with a small batch.

 

[IreneF]

That's a lot of onions. I don't have a pot that big. Are you talking about regular yellow onions?

 

[Richard7]

Hi,

were you other attempts with the same ingredients?

Another idea for why this might work might be the anti microbial effects of the spices, particularly the asafoetida and the tumeric, it could be feeding some parts of your microbiome with all of that fibre while suppressing other parts.

I went looking for info on asafoetida on wikipedia and came up with

GARG, S. K., BANERJEA, A. C., VERMA, J. and ABRAHAM, M. J. (1980), EFFECT OF VARIOUS TREATMENTS OF PULSES ON IN VITRO GAS PRODUCTION BY SELECTED INTESTINAL CLOSTRIDIA. Journal of Food Science, 45: 1601–1602. doi: 10.1111/j.1365-2621.1980.tb07571.x

Studies were performed to find out the effect of different treatments of pulses, like cooking, fermentation, incorporation of spices like raw garlic, and ginger powder on in vitro gas production by selected intestinal Clostridia. All treatments had profound influence on gas production; the amount of gas was reduced between 30–60%. Maximum reduction was noticed at 1.0% concentration of spices. Lag phase of growth was prolonged considerably, suggestive of temporary suppression of gas production. C. perfringens produced the highest amount of gas in all control samples and all treatments had maximum inhibitory effects on this organism.

I don't have access to the journal, but if a well emulsified supplement did not have the same effect as the curry this might be a place to look for an answer.

by the by, they emulsified the tumeric with castor oil. I wouldn't try that at home.