Methylation Journal-Misfit Toy

[Dreambirdie]

@Dreambirdie

http://www.professionalsupplementcenter.com/PharmaxVitaminB12CWS.htm

FANTASTIC to see this! HB12 at 10 mcg per drop!

Finally I can dose myself with the teeny weener doses I need, and not have to attempt to cut crumbling pills or count hundreds of drops of water for dilution.

Thank you.

 

[Misfit Toy]

Update-took more B12 hydroxy at 5 pm. Felt fine. No raciness. At 8:30-10-45pm ..I slept great! Could just be exhaustion from many sleepless nights but the B12 was fine today. And the yucca!

Praise a higher being!

 

[Critterina]

Amen, Sister!

So, will you skip another day tomorrow?

 

[Misfit Toy]

Critter-this is a very good question. If I sleep well tonight...I may take it tomorrow, or is that pushing it? I feel like take it on the AM's when you slept. Not on the AM where you didn't the night before because everything is muddled then.

Tomorrow I see my doc about the MCAS. @Critterina.

 

[Critterina]

Critter-this is a very good question. If I sleep well tonight...I may take it tomorrow, or is that pushing it? I feel like take it on the AM's when you slept. Not on the AM where you didn't the night before because everything is muddled then.

Tomorrow I see my doc about the MCAS. @Critterina.

Sounds like a good approach to me. Good luck tomorrow!

 

[Critterina]

So how did your day go?

 

[Misfit Toy]

@Critterina -thank you so much for checking in on me! I only got 4 hours of sleep last night. I am wrecked. I did take the B12 this AM and I was okay. I think it was about 150 mcg or 200. I had no problem.

I went to my doctor. He is concerned about my reaction to Depakote and why did I go down so far after my surgery in January...I have to call the surgeon and find out what type of anesthesia I had because it or something turned me upside down.

He wants me to have the Depakote compounded to see if this makes a difference. I have or was much better on it and really will hate not having it.

Anyway, he is fine with me taking it slow with the methylation and wants me to really concentrate on the CBS issues...with the molybdenum and then the Yucca. I am fine on those I think, but also to stick with the B12 and do this for awhile and then add in Folinic Acid..he says that would be better for me then methylfolate...we shall see.

How are you today? Is the salmon out of your system?

ps-my doc wants me to get off the taurine/magnesium shots which help pain so much. He says they are sulfate. Full of sulfur, which is my bigger problem. I am quite upset about this as they have helped my Fibro pain and my Sjogrens joint pain more than anything I have ever taken. I am now to go down to 2 a week and then maybe one a week...or none....nervous about this one.

 

[zzz]

ps-my doc wants me to get off the taurine/magnesium shots which help pain so much. He says they are sulfate. Full of sulfur, which is my bigger problem. I am quite upset about this as they have helped my Fibro pain and my Sjogrens joint pain more than anything I have ever taken. I am now to go down to 2 a week and then maybe one a week...or none....nervous about this one.

I'm afraid that your doctor does not know his biochemistry.

All forms of sulfur are not created equal. The most common forms ingested are sulfur, sulfites, sulfa drugs, and sulfates. Sulfates are necessary for human biochemistry.

For references, see, for example, Sulfa Allergy and Sulfite Allergy, What Is The Difference Between Sulfas, Sulfates & Sulfites?, and Allergies to Sulfur Compounds?. Here is the introduction from the last one, which can be corroborated from many sources:

Consumers who are allergic to sulfa drugs or have had reactions to sulfites in foods are often concerned about potential reactions when using dietary supplements containing sulfates or sulfur (i.e., glucosamine sulfate, chondroitin sulfate, MSM etc.). This practical report will help clear up some of the confusion between these similar compounds, while dispelling the notion that someone can be allergic to sulfates or sulfur in general. Simply put, sulfur in the form of sulfate is a necessary component to life and will not result in adverse reactions, while sulfa drugs and sulfites are sulfur derivatives with potentially harmful reactions in sensitive individuals.

Finally, do you have any evidence that your magnesium injections are causing you problems?

 

[Critterina]

@Critterina -thank you so much for checking in on me! I only got 4 hours of sleep last night. I am wrecked. I did take the B12 this AM and I was okay. I think it was about 150 mcg or 200. I had no problem.

So sorry to hear about the lack of sleep - I know what that can do when you're fragile. I'm really impressed you decided to go ahead with the B12 and that it was OK. That's very encouraging!

I went to my doctor. He is concerned about my reaction to Depakote and why did I go down so far after my surgery in January...I have to call the surgeon and find out what type of anesthesia I had because it or something turned me upside down.

He wants me to have the Depakote compounded to see if this makes a difference. I have or was much better on it and really will hate not having it.

It sounds like he's going to help you work around the problem you're having with it - I'm not sure how compounding helps, except for better control of the dose, do you?

Anyway, he is fine with me taking it slow with the methylation and wants me to really concentrate on the CBS issues...with the molybdenum and then the Yucca. I am fine on those I think, but also to stick with the B12 and do this for awhile and then add in Folinic Acid..he says that would be better for me then methylfolate...we shall see.

Ok, it sounds like you two have a plan. Why the folinic? That was so bad for me (but we are different! )

How are you today? Is the salmon out of your system?

Oh, thanks for asking. I did high dose prednisone yesterday because I was still up several pounds from the inflammation. This morning I was down less than 2, so I did another day of prednisone. If it's working, I should be down another 3-5 pounds tomorrow, and then I'll stop the prednisone. (If this sounds crazy, compare it to when I had general anesthesia - I swelled up so fast after the surgery, that I got a medrol pack about 6 pm the day after, I started taking it then and I lost 19 pounds in 3 days.) An extra bonus (back to today) is that I had torqued my knee (proximal fibula) somehow about a week ago, and it's been very stiff, painful, and popping, actually referring pain to my hip and ankle. This is really helping that. Well, this is a lesson learned. I tried to manage my reaction with the albutrol and afrin for the immediate symptoms, and NOT use the prednisone, but the salmon was 4 days ago, and the symptoms weren't responding to that.

ps-my doc wants me to get off the taurine/magnesium shots which help pain so much. He says they are sulfate. Full of sulfur, which is my bigger problem. I am quite upset about this as they have helped my Fibro pain and my Sjogrens joint pain more than anything I have ever taken. I am now to go down to 2 a week and then maybe one a week...or none....nervous about this one.

Well, sorry to hear that. Taurine will always have sulfur in it, but magnesium doesn't. Can you continue on at least some magnesium? I guess epsom salts are out - they are sulfate, but there has to be another magnesium.

I have a couple of tricks - that can be used to my detriment - when it comes to pain. I imagine a barrier in my brain separating the front of my head from the back. I only let the awareness of the pain go to the back. Don't let it come forward of the ears. It's a way I try to experience pain without suffering (suffering meaning that I'm wanting it to be different). The other is just to say "I will live through this moment/hour/day" - something I have to tell myself on a Tuesday morning when it's going to be Thursday night before I get to eat or drink anything more than water. Or when I am submitting to a painful medical exam or procedure. Just let the pain be there. (of course, keep it in the back of your head!) The only problem I have is that I'm pretty good and can endure things without getting help when I should. If you try it, don't get that good at it, ok?

P.S. Good boundary setting and defending there with zzz! You were nice, even-handed, and yet firm. Good job!

 

[Valentijn]

Anyway, he is fine with me taking it slow with the methylation and wants me to really concentrate on the CBS issues...with the molybdenum and then the Yucca.

"CBS issues" are a bit of a red flag. They're generally a myth started by Yasko with absolutely no basis in reality. Such treatments might theoretically help for an unknown reason, but not due to compensating for any genetic predisposition involving the CBS gene.

My biggest concern is that any treatment aimed at decreasing the activity or amount of CBS enzymes will 1) increase homocysteine, and 2) decrease glutathione. Though I'm not sure how molybdenum or Yucca would play into that.

 

[Misfit Toy]

I guess the problem @Valentijn is that everybody has such a completely different opinion about so much of this on here, which makes it even more confusing. I mean there is Rich's protocol, Fredd's protocol and then so many others on here have different opinions....how do you know who to believe?

It's a crapshoot.

 

[Valentijn]

I guess the problem @Valentijn is that everybody has such a completely different opinion about so much of this on here, which makes it even more confusing. I mean there is Rich's protocol, Fredd's protocol and then so many others on here have different opinions....how do you know who to believe?

It's a crapshoot.

Yes, I think a lot of it is a bit random and there's little or no real scientific support. Many things are still worth a try, if it's affordable and safe. My worry about CBS "treatment" is that it might not be particularly safe, as elevated homocysteine is associated with a lot of increased disease risks, and glutathione production is quite essential in mopping up the various messes we run into.

And in the case of the CBS genetic claims, it's 100% clear that they are completely baseless, unlike B12 + folate protocols which could be beneficial in various ways, and are unlikely to be harmful if approached carefully. I've read all of the research, and I (sort of) see how Yasko reached her conclusions about CBS, and it's a bit scary because of how bizarre her reasoning is.
The sad thing is that intelligent doctors with good intentions keep buying into her claims without bothering to investigate them.

It looks like Yucca doesn't down-regulate CBS, but rather is claimed to clean up ammonia somehow. Not sure if that is true or not, but at least it shouldn't lead to homocysteine or glutathione issues. And it looks like molybdenum is intended to speed up SUOX, rather than to do anything with CBS, so should also be safe enough on that basis. So it seems like the treatment is aimed at potential ammonia/sulfur problems rather than "CBS".

The big piece of advice for slowing down CBS that always makes me cringe is the avoidance of B6. Though the avoidance of sulfur containing foods doesn't seem like a great idea either, unless it's providing some other obvious benefit.

Anyhow, best of luck with whatever you choose

 

[Mary]

@Misfit Toy - I know you know how bad sugar is for the body, especially people with compromised health, as we all are here. l-glutamine may be able to help with your cravings - see http://healthdivas.blogspot.com/2012/09/shortcut-to-stop-sugar-and-starch.html

You mentioned adrenal problems and anxiety, and again, these are exacerbated by sugar. My sister has rheumatoid arthritis and is also a self-described sugar addict, but eating sugar is like playing with fire for her. She'd get off it, go back on it, over and over, until her husband told her to think of sugar as being like heroin for her. And that finally got through to her, and she quit it (along with white flour etc.)

Also, do you know your lithium levels? low lithium can cause anxiety. I take 5 mg. of Swanson's brand lithium orotate.

Good luck!

 

[Critterina]

Re: Li orotate. Oh, yeah. I don't put much stock in the NutraHacker report in any one specific thing, but my top 100 SNPs included 10 suggestions for lithium. 5 mg/day makes a difference in my mood. I increase to 10 for a week if I start to slip. Something to talk to your practitioner about, if you like.

 

[Misfit Toy]

@Mary -I agree about the sugar. It is like heroine.

The glutamine made me very anxious the last time I was on it. I was told to stop taking it. I remember writing about it on here in 2013. I took it for my gut issues.

I have lithium orotate so I can try that.

@Critterina -what is the Nutrahacker report?

 

[Mary]

The glutamine made me very anxious the last time I was on it. I was told to stop taking it. I remember writing about it on here in 2013. I took it for my gut issues.

That's too bad - I had forgotten, glutamine can either help produce GABA or glutamate, an excitotoxin. I think it's supposed to depend on what your body needs at the time. I do well with it, though I have no idea why it affects me differently than you - but we are all very different here! (and alike in many ways too)

I realized after the fact that my comment about sugar being like heroin might seem extreme - but in context it makes sense. My sister is a recovering alcoholic, she's been sober for 23 years (AA). She started developing rheumatoid arthritis (or lyme? No one is quite sure) symptoms almost 2 years ago. She's fought a battle with sugar for years, off and on forever it seems, so now her health is truly in jeopardy with the RA (or whatever it is) and her husband finally got through to her how dangerous sugar was for her, with the heroin analogy. That penetrated I guess her denial about how bad it was and has enabled her to cut out sugar and white flour for several weeks now ... one day at a time! (I had tried to get her to try glutamine but she wasn't interested - whatever it takes )

 

[Critterina]

@Critterina -what is the Nutrahacker report?

Online, you feed your 23andMe file into the NutraHacker and it gives you some reports - I think it's your top 10 and top 100 SNPs in spreadsheets with what the genes do (or how the SNP affects it), what to take, and what to avoid, plus these interactive maps that say what supplements to take and what to avoid, but none of it is deconflicted, so you might have the same supplement in both the "to take" and "to avoid." It also didn't take into account your symptoms or lab reports or sensitivities/intolerance. For example, with my undetectable sex hormone, it was recommending something to decrease estrogen. And there were things that were contraindicated by my histamine intolerance and my low cortisol. It may have improved drastically since I used it a couple years ago. It costs something, too, but not much.

I think if you are OK doing your own research, it's a good place to start. And for me, seeing 10 times: "you might benefit from lithium", it didn't even seem like research was needed at that point. I was a melancholy child and have struggled with depression at least 3-4 times as an adult, one of which was bad enough to require medication, that I PM'ed you about.

 

[Valentijn]

Nutrahacker does a lot of copy and pasting from various sources on the internet ... everything except the actual research papers regarding those SNPs apparently So basically it's a shortcut for googling thousands of SNPs yourself, which I suppose could be useful for saving time. What's less useful is that it's blindly repeating random stuff from the internet

They blatantly plagiarized a couple of my posts on this forum ... sentences were copied word for word. It led to some bizarre results in their report, since they ended up with one CBS SNP reflecting my view (a little fast = good), while the rest reflected the more widely disseminated Yasko view (CBS = CATASTROPHE!!11!!!1!!!ONE11!!!!1), and their advice ended up being internally contradictory as a result. They did eventually remove my text from their reports, after a PR moderator threatened to beat them with a large stick.

 

[Misfit Toy]

July 10th 2015-One week after starting B12 on it's own and doing Yucca and Moly. Well, the clarity that I felt a week ago has ebbed. Maybe it's because I am on such a low dose or maybe it's because I am just so exhausted from not sleeping for so long.

Last night I died. I went to bed at 1 am and fell asleep by 1:01. Who knows why since normally 3 am is when I fall asleep, but I will take it. I had 5 hours of solid sleep and then more sleep that wasn't so solid. So tired. This happens sometimes after I sleep. I am more tired.

I take my B12 within like 10 minutes of waking up on an empty stomach. If anyone reads this, is that okay to do? I think I am looking forward to increasing my dose, but will split dose to the afternoon. Not sure when to do this, but I don't believe I am having negative effects.

We had another crazy hurricane storm pass through last night and today it's gorgeous out. I am going to go out and sit in the sun today. The sun makes me tired, but it's not as humid from the storm and the sun lifts my mood. SAD kicks in in the winter and I am like a squirrel trying to store nuts.

 

[Valentijn]

@Misfit Toy - I haven't heard of B12 being any problem at all on an empty stomach. I usually took mine on an empty stomach, or at least not near meals.