• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

Do Sleeping Pills Give Alzheimers?

Nielk

Senior Member
Messages
6,970
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...-examine-worrying-evidence.html#ixzz3DSY6VJ4f

Excerpt

Most benzodiazepines have a strong sedative effect, helping to relieve the insomnia that accompanies anxiety.

They work by reducing activity in the part of the brain that controls emotion, by boosting the action of a chemical called gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA).

This chemical reduces the signals between brain cells, and has a calming effect on the brain, muscles and heart rate.

Under guidelines from the UK’s Safety of Medicines Committee, the drugs should be prescribed for only two to four weeks because of the risk of addiction.

However, patients may be taking them for far longer, warns Dr Allen Young, chair of the Royal College of Psychiatrists’ psycho-pharmacy committee.

‘My concern is that prescriptions are sometimes not reviewed and a patient can end up on them for long periods of time.

'For example, they may be prescribed the drugs in hospital for acute symptoms and then just stay on them long-term when they go home.’

Indeed, research in 2001 by Heather Ashton, professor emeritus of psychopharmacology at Newcastle University, suggests that around 1.5 million people in the UK are addicted to the drugs, and experts say little has changed since then.

Professor Ashton says: ‘If you take benzos, they dampen down neurotransmitters — chemical messengers — in the brain.

'It may be that after you stop taking them, these neurotransmitters come back, but they’re not as good. The point is we don’t know because long-term follow-up studies have never been done.’

Commenting on the latest study, Dr Chris Fox, a consultant psychiatrist who specialises in care of the elderly, says memory problems ‘are a well-known short-term side-effect of benzodiazepines, but side-effects usually disappear once you stop taking them.

'But it may be in that some people this effect is permanent.’

How exactly they may damage the brain is unknown, he says, but suggests they could alter the connections between brain cells, or even the structure of the brain itself.

He points to a number of studies that have linked an increased risk of Alzheimer’s with benzodiazepine use, including a 2012 French study which found that elderly patients who took them were 60 per cent more likely to develop dementia than those who did not.

He says further research is urgently needed.

‘What we need to find out is if benzodiazepines do cause permanent damage to the brain — is it like radiation, in that if you are exposed just once, then the damage is done?



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...-examine-worrying-evidence.html#ixzz3DTo2SNOI
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
 

Simon

Senior Member
Messages
3,789
Location
Monmouth, UK
Normally, I wouldn't trust the Daily Mail on health stories, but this is about a pretty robust study that provides good (though not definitive) evidence that long-term use of benzodiazapine's such as klonopin can increase Alzheimer's by about 50%. Give that the risk of Alzheimer's is relatively high anyway, a 50% increase in risk would be important. And klonopin in particular (clonazepam) came out as one of the worse benzos as it is long-lasting.

The threshold for a significant risk was 6-months of daily doses over 5 years - equivalent to 3 daily doses a month.

Note that this study is on elderly patients, but the fact that long-term use of benzos can increase Az risk in any population is likely to be of concern to those who use these meds.

Benzodiazepine use and risk of Alzheimer’s disease: case-control study | The BMJ

Abstract
Objectives To investigate the relation between the risk of Alzheimer’s disease and exposure to benzodiazepines started at least five years before, considering both the dose-response relation and prodromes (anxiety, depression, insomnia) possibly linked with treatment.

Design Case-control study.

Setting The Quebec health insurance program database (RAMQ).

Participants 1796 people with a first diagnosis of Alzheimer’s disease and followed up for at least six years before were matched with 7184 controls on sex, age group, and duration of follow-up. Both groups were randomly sampled from older people (age >66) living in the community in 2000-09.

Main outcome measure The association between Alzheimer’s disease and benzodiazepine use started at least five years before diagnosis was assessed by using multivariable conditional logistic regression. Ever exposure to benzodiazepines was first considered and then categorised according to the cumulative dose expressed as prescribed daily doses (1-90, 91-180, >180) and the drug elimination half life.

Results Benzodiazepine ever use was associated with an increased risk of Alzheimer’s disease (adjusted odds ratio 1.51, 95% confidence interval 1.36 to 1.69; further adjustment on anxiety, depression, and insomnia did not markedly alter this result: 1.43, 1.28 to 1.60). No association was found for a cumulative dose <91 prescribed daily doses. The strength of association increased with exposure density (1.32 (1.01 to 1.74) for 91-180 prescribed daily doses and 1.84 (1.62 to 2.08) for >180 prescribed daily doses) and with the drug half life (1.43 (1.27 to 1.61) for short acting drugs and 1.70 (1.46 to 1.98) for long acting ones).

Conclusion Benzodiazepine use is associated with an increased risk of Alzheimer’s disease. The stronger association observed for long term exposures reinforces the suspicion of a possible direct association, even if benzodiazepine use might also be an early marker of a condition associated with an increased risk of dementia. Unwarranted long term use of these drugs should be considered as a public health concern.
 

adreno

PR activist
Messages
4,841
It has been known for a long time that long term use of benzos cause cognitive impairment, so I'm not too surprised about this.
 

john66

Senior Member
Messages
159
I agree that it is not a good idea to be on sleep meds, but what choice to some of of have? Not sleeping at all destroys health much faster than sleeping drugs.
 

adreno

PR activist
Messages
4,841
maybe its the poor sleep for which they are on benzo's for which is increasing the risks of alzheimers .
No one really knows, something worth study?
From the conclusion:
The stronger association observed for long term exposures reinforces the suspicion of a possible direct association, even if benzodiazepine use might also be an early marker of a condition associated with an increased risk of dementia.
 

boohealth

Senior Member
Messages
243
Location
south
The question is, why are they taking long term benzos (which I have, though titrated down to lowish dose, I'm now going to continue the titration to a very low dose).

Glutamate is toxic, too, and benzos can help quench upregulated glutamate. The question is, and it's key, are they medicating something else that is the genuine cause of the Alzheimer's? It's hard for me to conceive that six months is enough to increase risk by 50%. It's easier for me to believe that there is some kind of increase, but that the long term benzo use is linked to either chronic infection, chronic toxicity, or chronic inflammation that leads to such poor sleep, and is the actual meaningful correlation. Benzos could be a leading indicator of that.
 

maddietod

Senior Member
Messages
2,859
This was reported today in the Washington Post here. It says of 8990 adults studied, 52% had taken benzos in the previous 5 years. Those who had taken the drugs were 51% more likely to have Alzheimer's than those who had never taken them. The longer benzos were taken, the higher the risk, but ONLY if they were taken for greater than 90 days in 5 years.

Risk was lower for shorter-acting benzos than for longer-acting.

"Some study participants may have been prescribed benzodiazepines to treat early symptoms of unrecognized dementia...." (@heapsreal )
 

Dreambirdie

work in progress
Messages
5,569
Location
N. California
I had a horrible experience with Lorazepam this summer, which I wrote up at length on this thread: http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...d-my-health-and-sanity-for-4-1-2-weeks.31972/

I am not in the least bit surprised that they might be implicated in Alzheimer's. They definitely can and do reek havoc with your brain chemistry. Many people have suffered *severe* long term withdrawal symptoms when they go off them. That speaks volumes about how dangerous they are.
 

heapsreal

iherb 10% discount code OPA989,
Messages
10,089
Location
australia (brisbane)
one has to weigh up the risk to benefit ratio for themselves. I wouldnt be able to function without sleep meds and wouldnt be able to work and support myself/family. I would probably be on disability if it wasnt for sleep meds and antivirals. So for me the benefit ratio leans heavily towards me. I think most of us cfs/me have some type of dementia/memory issues if we take benzo's or not.

To me it seems the people that end up with big issues with benzos are normally on xanax and or klonopin, for some reason. This is also what my doc has said. He is happy prescribing valium as it says its alot safer benzo in his experience.

Its a tough call. If i didnt have to work and fit into a schedule, i could probably live without sleep meds but i think my quality of life would suffer. Benzos are always a hot topic.
 

Nielk

Senior Member
Messages
6,970
I might as well check mysel in an Alzeimer"s ward!

I took Klinopin for over 7 years straight. Working myself up to 3mg a day. I would probably still be on it if it wasn't for the fact that it almost killed me.

I understand when people say that they need it for sleep. The problem is that one becomes dependent on it. They stop taking it, can't fall asleep and go back on it. The thinking being that they still have insomnia. This could be true but it is also possible that what they are experiencing is withdrawal.

I don't know what the answer is. It could be that there is a benefit to keep switching to different treatments so that we don't become dependent on any one.
I know though that it's really hard to stop something that works.

I do believe though that Klonopin could have dangerous effects on the nervous system.

I have been off if it for over two years and still suffer from the effects.
 

heapsreal

iherb 10% discount code OPA989,
Messages
10,089
Location
australia (brisbane)
I might as well check mysel in an Alzeimer"s ward!

I took Klinopin for over 7 years straight. Working myself up to 3mg a day. I would probably still be on it if it wasn't for the fact that it almost killed me.

I understand when people say that they need it for sleep. The problem is that one becomes dependent on it. They stop taking it, can't fall asleep and go back on it. The thinking being that they still have insomnia. This could be true but it is also possible that what they are experiencing is withdrawal.

I don't know what the answer is. It could be that there is a benefit to keep switching to different treatments so that we don't become dependent on any one.
I know though that it's really hard to stop something that works.

I do believe though that Klonopin could have dangerous effects on the nervous system.

I have been off if it for over two years and still suffer from the effects.

Its a tricky subject.

Before i had cfs i have seen many abuse or put on high doses of benzo's, so was cautious. For me i gave my self a top dose i wouldnt go over which was equal to 10mg of valium which i think is about .5-1mg of klono i think. At that dose generally i think if one stops it for a few days, which i have done when it has stopped working, it doesnt cause too many issues other then disturbed sleep for me but i usually get around this by using some other non benzo med. I try to do this regular as i think it has helped me to avoid tolerance.

I dont know if my sleep off benzo's is a withdrawal or some type of dependency or if my sleep is just buggered from cfs/me? But i have found a system that mostly works for me. I constantly rotate between things etc and or add natural substances too. I think all these things have helped me to keep my doses low and be able to avoid tolerance.

I also think that just my general improvement in cfs/me after treating infection/immune isssues has improved my sleep, even though im still on sleep meds. My sleep has improved and nothing like what it use to be when i would write a post on not sleeping every couple of weeks. So i think for me treating the cause of cfs/me has played a part in improving my sleep and i think shows that for me that the infection/immune isssues played a significant role in my sleep problems??

Its very individual issue and maybe for others who had doses pushed quite high, may have done some damage to their sleep.

it would be interesting to see a study or to know if those with sleep issues in cfs/me who havent used any sleep meds before, have some type of gaba receptor resistance, sort of like diabetes have insulin resistance? There are alot of cfs/me people who have never used benzo's and have ongoing sleep issues, so its hard to know if the use of benzos was the cause of current sleep issues or its just progression of cfs/me.
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
This association between benzodiazepine use and the later development of Alzheimer's may relate to the fact that a murine study found insomnia is an early sign of Alzheimer’s, and if this applies to humans, then people would experience insomnia for some years before they get Alzheimer's, and may be prescribed benzodiazepines.
 

maddietod

Senior Member
Messages
2,859
Related to the insomnia + memory issues, not Alzheimer's: I took benadryl nightly for months for sleep, and then suddenly suffered profound recent-memory loss. I didn't take it for years, and took it once 2 weeks ago for allergies. The next few days my immediate short-term memory was unusually spotty.

Then I tried liquid melatonin so I could titrate up from a tiny dose. After 10 days I was up to 1.5mg, and I noticed memory issues again .

I have memory problems anyway, but I know what's normal for me, and these reactions were disturbing. Since no sleep medication or supplement has helped me, other than benadryl, I'm left very curious about the mechanism(s) causing our insomnia, and what's being disturbed by the remedies that do work.
 

Dreambirdie

work in progress
Messages
5,569
Location
N. California
I saw this posted by someone I know on FB "benzos deplete biotin, folate, vitamin D and K, calcium and melatonin, all of which help our brain function. Another source says they deplete white blood cell glutathione by 50%..."

and this: "And Klonopin is the only benzo to my knowledge that can cause anemia, leukopenia, thrombocytopenia, and eosinophilia."

There is a HUGE list of side effects attributed to Klonopin use: http://www.rxlist.com/klonopin-side-effects-drug-center.htm
 

Dreambirdie

work in progress
Messages
5,569
Location
N. California
I might as well check mysel in an Alzeimer"s ward!

I took Klinopin for over 7 years straight. Working myself up to 3mg a day. I would probably still be on it if it wasn't for the fact that it almost killed me.

What you went through was horrific! But the good news is that the brain has the ability to repair itself over time, especially if given the right nutrients and foods.

It's good that you stopped the K when you did. I hope that the negative effects wear off soon.
 

Nielk

Senior Member
Messages
6,970
What you went through was horrific! But the good news is that the brain has the ability to repair itself over time, especially if given the right nutrients and foods.

It's good that you stopped the K when you did. I hope that the negative effects wear off soon.

Thank you. As hard of a journey as it has been withdrawing from Klonopin, I am glad that it has been successful.
I do have symptoms though that I never had before even with my ME. They seem to mimick symptoms of ADHD. Even though I had difficulty concentrating and problems with my memory before - because of my ME, this added feeling of jumpiness and impatience is hard to live with - especially since it is new for me.