Starting out on Acyclovir

[BadBadBear]

Hi,

I am getting ready to give the Lerner protocol a try to see if my EBV symptoms will recede. They have been really bad this year. I have read that the protocol is difficult and that some people can't handle acyclovir well. Does anyone have insight on a good protocol for starting out on acyclovir? Can I start at 1 gram for a month and then add another gram, and then work up slowly?

I have an event that I really want to attend at the end of Sept. and was not wanting to jump into the protocol with both feet until after that, but at the same time, I am burning time sleeping my life away while this flare up is going.

Could I start at a lower level and still possibly make some gains for the next month?

TIA,
Michelle

 

[herpesbaby]

First of all, Lerner never suggested acyclovir. You need to take Valtrex! Its bioavailability is way higher than the regular acyclovir. Valtrex turns into acyclovir in your liver, that's why it works.
How much do you weight? You'll need to take 3-4 grams of valtrex a day. Make sure you drink lots of water, otherwise that acyclovir will turn into kidney stones.

You will also need to be checking your liver and kidneys function every 4-6 weeks. Basically ALT AST and GGTP levels, as well as urineanalysis and creatinine in blood. If anything goes up, you'll have to stop valtrex.
You'll see side effects, if there are any, immediately. At the beginning I was manic and psychotic and suicidal and alert af. It'll go away in 2-4 days.

 

[herpesbaby]

Lower doses, in my humble opinion, won't work. Woman, there were studies! Lerner suggested high doses for a reason and unless you are anorexic, do not take low doses. Itll be a waste of money.

 

[herpesbaby]

Re good effects: when I was on valtrex my low grade fever went away, headache subsided, I felt better and had more energy.

 

[herpesbaby]

So it was costly because I don't have insurance and that's one of the reasons why I stopped. But, here in developing eastern country, pharmacies cell medicine that have expiration date thats in 6 or less months, half price.
It was still pricey though. I don't know if it's the same in the west in terms of pricing. If I had more money id buy famvir because its bioavailability is even higher than valtrex.

 

[cb2]

Question. If valtrex turns into acyclovir wouldn't it be the same just to take acyclovir?
Thanks
Ps, also explains why I dont feel benefit from acyclovir. I only take 1.6 gram a day.

 

[herpesbaby]

Question. If valtrex turns into acyclovir wouldn't it be the same just to take acyclovir?
Thanks

No it wouldn't. When you take acyclovir orally, it doesn't go to your bloodstream right away. It goes literally to yous stomach. It eventually does go to your bloodstream, but in very tiny percentage of it. You'd have to take gazillion of pills per day to achieve the bioavailability of Valtrex, and it still would not cross the blood brain barrier.

When people's herpes goes to their brains, for instance, that's the reason why acyclovir is administered by doctors via IV. When it is taken orally, it does not cross the blood brain barrier.

 

[herpesbaby]

We are roughly talking about 10 vs 55% of bioavailability. @cb2

 

[herpesbaby]

Also, those who want to try Lerner's, or any other protocol really that requires daily prolonged medical therapy. Liver and kidneys function should be checked before the treatment

 

[cb2]

I am not good with science. I am still confused about the acyclovir from straight acyclovir being different than what gets converted from Valtrex ? It seems the conversion process might lose some acyclovir? Also how do they tell if herpes has gone to brain? I have often wondered about this as with my flare ups my eye hurts and it is always the same side.

I am a patient at Dr. Montoya's clinic they hardly ever run blood tests for liver and kidneys. I think they should maybe they're not because I'm on such a low dose? Maybe I should go have a visit with them and talk about switching and increasing.

I hope you can find a way to get some medicine @ herpes baby

 

[cb2]

I found this...I am way under medicated! Thanks for pointing this out!


https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...gglMAA&usg=AFQjCNEPxboNyNWoMUGKqXXi0_Usg8l1tg

 

[herpesbaby]

Please read the instructions of the pills then and believe pills' bioavailability info, It is calculated by scientists and approved by authorities. @cb2

Re your question on brain: you WOULD KNOW. When virus really hits the brain that's when people cant think properly, can't draw circles, are always crazy sleepy, start having different personality, and/or other SCARY symptoms.

Re eyes: it can be nerves. Get it checked with a doctor.

 

[herpesbaby]

imho u should change a doctor/clinic @cb2

 

[BadBadBear]

Thanks, I did mean Valacylovir. My brain has been really foggy lately.

I am 5'10 and around 175#, so not a small person. I had hoped that starting lower and slower would ameliorate some of the negative symptoms experienced at higher dosing, but if it is completely ineffective at lower doses, then there would be no point.

My Integrative MD doc will monitor liver, kidney function and I just got labs recently, also to rule out some other issues (tested negative for strep, mycoplasma, anaplasmosis). Those labs included my liver enzymes and creatinine. Need a baseline for GTT. Still need to check lyme/babesia labs as well. Fortunately I've been negative for all the coinfections I have tested for - CMV, HHV6, WNV, etc.

And yep, running a low grade fever today. Lysine seems to help me, but I ALWAYS get a fever if I take any lysine?

I need to look at dosing info for Famvir to see how it compares to Valacylovir.

 

[cb2]

wishing you great success @BadBadBear
please keep us posted

i am looking at my stanford labs and trying to see if this means negative or positive according to dr learners site?
any thoughts? thank you


TEST PARAMETERS AND METHODOLOGY

Reference Range - Result: Negative

Reference Range - Level: <1.10

Methodology: Enzyme-Linked Immunosorbent Assay (ELISA)

This assay detects IgG antibodies against the Epstein-Barr Virus Nuclear Antigen-1 (EBNA-1). It is approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration.

COMPONENT YOUR VALUE STANDARD RANGE
EBNA IgG Result Positive Negative
EBNA IgG Level 4.37 ISR ISR

 

[cb2]

here is a page about the 3 medications and bio-availability.
i know when i tried the valtrex, generic i felt horribly depressed, not sure if that is typical? know of one other person that had that experince...also wondering if it might have been the blue dyes used in the generic tablet?
i wonder if it comes without coloring?

http://www.emedexpert.com/compare/herpes-antivirals.shtml

 

[heapsreal]

People have done well on low doses of antivirals. Many find it best to start low and increase slowly. They are generally used in low doses for suppression therapy eg 500mg a day of valtrex. Personally i think 500mg twice a day can be enough for ebv.

Famvir helped me at 250mg twice a day, last few yrs i have increased it to 500mg twice a day. Lerner recommending famvir at 1500mg 3 to 4 times a day, i think its over kill.

I suggest famvir because it might have a broader range of effects than valtrex. Although valtrex and famvir have short half lives like 3 to 4 hrs, famvir is said to have an 18hr intracellular half life. I havent been able to find the same info on valtrex. Id say famvir at 250mg twice a day is a good starting point.

Another option to use that can be more economical if one wants to use high doses like lerner used, one can take their av with probenecid that increases the blood levels and half life of avs, so one can use a lower dose and be just as effective as higher doses. Also even if low doses are too costly, one could take one daily av dose a day eg 250 to 500mg with probenicid.

Caution with probenecid which is commonly used for gout, it can increase blood levels of other drugs which may be dangerous such as anti inflammatories, abx and benzos plus other meds, so important to work with a dr and double check all the meds you are on for interactions.

 

[cb2]

@heapsreal thanks for your reply. how are you feeling, or what are you/ have you noticed since the increase? in what ways would you say taking the av' s have helped you?

do you think famvir will work just as fine for HSV-1 my titers are always super high on that one..and i keep getting repeated inflammation on the roof of my mouth , pretty sure it's from the HSV -1

hope you are doing well. and thanks again- great tips about keeping the costs down. I also saw on the stanford website some links for getting help getting meds, but i can't find that right now. will try to look some more later and post.

 

[heapsreal]

@heapsreal thanks for your reply. how are you feeling, or what are you/ have you noticed since the increase? in what ways would you say taking the av' s have helped you?

do you think famvir will work just as fine for HSV-1 my titers are always super high on that one..and i keep getting repeated inflammation on the roof of my mouth , pretty sure it's from the HSV -1

hope you are doing well. and thanks again- great tips about keeping the costs down. I also saw on the stanford website some links for getting help getting meds, but i can't find that right now. will try to look some more later and post.

Im doing well on avs and they make a big difference. Just last week i lowered my dose of famvir and had viral symptoms and shingles pain flare up so jumped back to higher doses. I try this every so often and reaffirms i need them.

Famvir should be good for hsv1. Non cfs people can take a 1 off 1500mg dose for hsv1 and sort the problem but if chronic issues and cfs then would probably need constant dosing.

Not sure what famvir costs you but some online pharmacies arent priced too badly eg alldaychemist.

 

[cb2]

thank you @heapsreal how long have you been on avs ? do you remember how long after starting them you could tell they were working? sorry if this is too many questions. I am definitely a cfs person and have alot of viral symptoms. my immune systems does some strange things.

i have been taking acyclovair 800mg 2x a day..wondering if i should bump it up or just have it switched as i can't tell it is doing anything at this point.

thanks for taking the time