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David Tuller / Trial by Error: My E-Mail Exchange With NICE Chief Executive 14 August 2017

Cheshire

Senior Member
Messages
1,129
On Friday, I had an e-mail exchange with Sir Andrew Dillon, chief executive of the NICE Guidance Executive. The other seven Guidance Executive members are various directors within the NICE hierarchy, including the communications director. This group will make the final decision about whether to accept the provisional decision of a NICE surveillance review team to leave as is CG53, the guidance for CFS/ME released in 2007. (I have written about the NICE review process on CG53 here, here and here.)

http://www.virology.ws/2017/08/14/trial-by-error-my-e-mail-exchange-with-nice-chief-executive/
 
Messages
2,158
An excellent letter from David Tuller. I think it's really important because it demonstrates that the actions of NICE are being watched by scientists around the world. Dillon can't say now that he wasn't aware of the issues with PACE, since he has acknowledged receipt of this letter that spells it out very clearly.
 
Messages
2,391
Location
UK
And the letter might even have helped make him aware of some issues too?
I think that could be very true.

Many years ago I remember seeing Brighton Marina being built, which comprises massive concrete pillars butted up to each other, going out into the sea. A huge crane-on-rails was used to build each new pillar, and once complete the railway was extended onto it, so the crane could advance further, to build the next one.

David's letter is a bit like that, and superb for it. Each question forms part of the preparatory work for later questions, and as such it is an excellent educational work in its own right. Just what the doctor ordered! :)
 

Jonathan Edwards

"Gibberish"
Messages
5,256
Many years ago I remember seeing Brighton Marina being built, which comprises massive concrete pillars butted up to each other, going out into the sea. A huge crane-on-rails was used to build each new pillar, and once complete the railway was extended onto it, so the crane could advance further, to build the next one.

Is that why the berthing fees are so extortionate!!
 

Stewart

Senior Member
Messages
291
Quite, it's important to realise a lot of people are holding their feet to the fire.

(not, as you understand, in a literal manner, for the avoidance of doubt for any lawyers for QMUL or NICE reading)

There's no point adding a mealy-mouthed disclaimer like that - as far as Sir Simon is concerned you've as good as admitted that you're actively plotting to have him burned at the stake.

You should expect your post (highly edited and taken completely out of context of course) to appear in one of his powerpoint presentations in the very near future. :)
 

Sean

Senior Member
Messages
7,378
He doesn't want to become aware of any issues. He will go to any lengths to avoid becoming aware of any issues.
Which is precisely why he and others with relevant authority need to be made aware, and very overtly, so that pleading ignorance is not an option.

Sadly, these people, and the system of governance that allows such behaviour, are going to have to be publicly shamed into doing the right thing. They have had plenty of chances over the years to do it voluntarily, and have completely failed to do so. There is no acceptable plea left they can enter, not even in mitigation.
 
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Cheshire

Senior Member
Messages
1,129
I found this comment from @Graham very interesting:

As for CBT being recommended for other conditions, I carried out a quick search of their guidelines, and apart from clearly psychological areas, only found three references to CBT: one was for MS, where it was mentioned in one sentence - "Consider mindfulness-based training, cognitive behaviour therapy or fatigue management for treating MS-related fatigue": one was for those who have suffered a heart attack - "do not routinely offer complex psychological interventions such as cognitive behavioural therapy": and the third was, of course, for CFS/ME where they dedicated nearly 120 lines to CBT and graded exercise.
 
Messages
2,391
Location
UK
I think that could be very true.

Many years ago I remember seeing Brighton Marina being built, which comprises massive concrete pillars butted up to each other, going out into the sea. A huge crane-on-rails was used to build each new pillar, and once complete the railway was extended onto it, so the crane could advance further, to build the next one.

David's letter is a bit like that, and superb for it. Each question forms part of the preparatory work for later questions, and as such it is an excellent educational work in its own right. Just what the doctor ordered! :)
Is that why the berthing fees are so extortionate!!
Could be :).

It is actually why I also particularly like, and recommend, your article "PACE team response shows a disregard for the principles of science", because it follows the same educational principle, as well as making its own strong case.