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Lactobacillus Fermentum: a probiotic that creates/recycles glutathione, improves heart health

Basilico

Florida
Messages
948
Lactobacillus Fermentum is a probiotic that just appeared on my radar. I haven't tried it yet, myself, and I couldn't find any threads on it here, so I'm wondering if anyone knows about it or has any experience with it.

The main reason it's piqued my curiosity is that it appears to create and recycle glutathione. Since it is widely hypothesized that CFS/ME folks are deficient in glutathione, perhaps having a deficit of LF could explain why levels are too low. We know that CFS/ME and GI problems often go hand in hand. My husband has a noticeable improvement when he takes liposomal glutathione...perhaps supporting the gut flora that can create it endogenously is even better than supplementing it.

Despite the "Lactobacillus" name, this particular probiotic is not found in yogurt, but I have found it available in capsules on Amazon. LF was isolated from the GI system of Estonian kids (much like the E. Coli Nissile 1017 - Mutaflor - was isolated from the GI system of a German soldier who was the only one in his troop to not get sick from a water-born pathogen).

From some research I've found:

It has been established that L. fermentum strain ME-3 has double functional properties: antimicrobial activity against intestinal pathogens and high total antioxidative activity (TAA) and total antioxidative status (TAS) of intact cells and lysates, and it is characterized by a complete glutathione system: synthesis, uptake and redox turnover. The functional efficacy of the antimicrobial and antioxidative probiotic has been proven by the eradication of salmonellas and the reduction of liver and spleen granulomas in Salmonella Typhimurium-infected mice treated with the combination of ofloxacin and L. fermentum strain ME-3.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2670518/



It also seems to have a beneficial effect on the cardiovascular system:

Eight weeks of consuming kefir with the antioxidative probiotic L. fermentum ME-3, reduced serum LDL-C, ox-LDL and TG values in clinically healthy volunteers with borderline-high lipid profile indices. Thus, L. fermentum ME-3 has potential to lower the risk of CVD that is tightly associated with maintenance of plasma lipid profile.
https://bmcnutr.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40795-015-0020-z
 
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PatJ

Forum Support Assistant
Messages
5,288
Location
Canada
Eight weeks of consuming kefir

If all milk kefir (especially home made) has this probiotic then maybe that explains why my sensitivity to light emitted by computer monitors has lessened somewhat since I starting consuming kefir. Liposomal gluatathione has the same effect. I still take, and benefit, from the liposomal glutathione, and notice a more beneficial effect from it than the kefir.
 

Basilico

Florida
Messages
948
If all milk kefir (especially home made) has this probiotic then maybe that explains why my sensitivity to light emitted by computer monitors has lessened somewhat since I starting consuming kefir. Liposomal gluatathione has the same effect. I still take, and benefit, from the liposomal glutathione, and notice a more beneficial effect from it than the kefir.

Unfortunately, no kefir or anything fermented naturally has Lactobacillus Fermentum. This particular study used kefir as the delivery method; one group received kefir that had added Lactobacillus Fermentum while the control group received kefir without any Lactobacillus Fermentum.

It's cool that you are having positive effects from kefir! It's just not due to LF.
 

PatJ

Forum Support Assistant
Messages
5,288
Location
Canada
Unfortunately, no kefir or anything fermented naturally has Lactobacillus Fermentum.

If you look on page three of the PDF "Chemical and microbiological aspects of kefir" you'll find that Lactobcillus Fermentum is listed. It's also commonly listed on sites that provide information about kefir such as this one.

There is also this document that found 90 strains of LF in "traditional dairy products" of Tibet and other regions. I found that document in a footnote of this one about Tibetan kefir grains, so I'm assuming that those traditional dairy products include Tibetan kefir.

Maybe it's only the ME-3 specific strain that isn't found in fermented products (although the "fermentum" in the name looks like a sure sign it's related to fermentation).

Why do you think it isn't in anything naturally fermented? (I'm too brainfogged to read the documents you linked so I apologize if the answer is found in them.)
 
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Basilico

Florida
Messages
948
Why do you think it isn't in anything naturally fermented? (I'm too brainfogged to read the documents you linked so I apologize if the answer is found in them.)

That info you posted looks interesting, I will check it out soon!

I haven't heard of it being in anything fermented because it was isolated from the GI system of Estonian kids. But who knows...maybe it's found in multiple sources?
 

Basilico

Florida
Messages
948
@kgg12003 that's a great link - that's where I first learned about Mutaflor a few years ago. I didn't realized he mentioned LF on that website, too!
 

NotThisGuy

Senior Member
Messages
312
where can we buy this magical probiotic?
Im from europe and would be happy if any one can suggest a brand or vendor.
 

NotThisGuy

Senior Member
Messages
312
Yeah i have checked them. Besides mutaflor germany isn't that probiotic country it always seems from a foreign point of view.
I think our health care is even worse than USA. (statistics says otherwise, but in USA you can at least buy supplements for good prices. In germany everything costs much more and lots of stuff isn't even available here. Also not a single good CFS specialist here)


Only product I found:

https://www.shop-apotheke.com/arzne...7751/&ef_id=V2FcggAABVpDPHJq:20170626011533:s

But this contains also Lactobacillus delbrueckii.

Since i seem to have mast cell issues and definitely have histamine issues I can't risk to take any random probiotics.
My gut is very sensible....

Since you have some knowledge about probiotics. Do you know any probiotic strain that can increase dopamine?
Always when i manage to push my dopamine levels up my gut becomes so much better and stable...

I can buy from any vendor in the EU by the way.
 

Timaca

Senior Member
Messages
792
I was looking at the Dr. Ohhira's Probiotic and found this interesting bit of info on the website:

Ingredients are fermented and processed for three years using 12 strains of lactic acid bacteria. All strains may not be present in final product.

Well, that's not helpful if all strains may not be present! Gee whiz!
 

echobravo

Keep searching, the answer is out there
Messages
137
Location
Norway
> it is characterized by a complete glutathione system: synthesis, uptake and redox turnover

Could anyone explain what "redox turnover" means in this context?
 

Gondwanaland

Senior Member
Messages
5,092
I read about LF a couple of months ago when this review was published. It is on my list, but I haven't ordered it yet because it stimulates Th1 (which might not be an issue). When I order probiotics again in a few weeks I will also trial this one.
germany isn't that probiotic country it always seems from a foreign point of view.
Interestingly it is the only country I have visited that made my gut healthy (traditionally fermented rye bread? - back when I still ate gluten).
https://www.healthrising.org/blog/2013/12/15/ken-lassesen-changing-gut-ecosystem-probiotics/
Ken Lassesen on December 16, 2013 at 8:57 am
Breakfast is usually a slice of German 100% heavy rye bread (imports from Europe — I can get 1 lb of it from our local Deli or Amazon for about $3.50, it does not go stale or mold fast, and a single slice is filling) The shelf life of a sealed package is 6+ months. Rye encourages the most diversity of microflora of all prebiotics tested in one study. Often with peanut butter or meat slice on top — this morning it was liver pate (high in iron).

I maintain a preference for high protein (lots of meats, fish) and low carbohydrates (except for rye bread) — which comes out of my first and second remissions.

To this, the usual supplements, 15000 IU of vitamin D, multivitamin with minerals, 500 mg of flushing niacin. Other items added when something suggests them.

Usual cavaet: every ones microflora is different and unique — so experimentation is often required — taking notes and being systematic (1 week during this, one week doing that) is essential.

  • Ken Lassesen on December 16, 2013 at 8:58 am
    PS: Every one else in the family is gluten intolerant (except me) — so while I do have the occasional gluten-goodies, there is very little gluten in my diet.
 
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Basilico

Florida
Messages
948

I just ordered (and received) this same one. We're waiting until we do the uBiome test again (the first one apparently got screwed up?) so as soon as that is done, we'll start in on this probiotic and hopefully have some positive news to report. I hope others who are trying it update, as well!
 

Basilico

Florida
Messages
948
2 week update:

My husband has been taking this probiotic every evening for about 2 weeks at this point. Today we realized that yesterday he did some stuff that would usually wipe him out, but he was actually feeling relatively decent. He also had a beer and didn't feel it at all, which is quite unusual because lately he has been reacting even very small amounts of alcohol. I think this is a sign his liver is functioning better, but still too early to tell for sure. So far, it does seem like the probiotic is starting to do something, and he is feeling more convinced about continuing to take it.
 
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