• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

An Update on ME/CFS Research with Ronald W. Davis, PhD

Cheesus

Senior Member
Messages
1,292
Location
UK
Is it safe to assume at this point that they have ran serum/cells from other immune mediated diseases that feature fatigue as a symptom through the impedance assay and they look different than ME patients?

They didn't mention that, though the impedance assay was specific to metabolic dysfunction rather than immune dysfunction. So I would think it is more important to compare it to metabolic mediated diseases rather than immune mediated diseases.
 

Forbin

Senior Member
Messages
966
...if you have virtually no observations you can’t generate a good hypothesis

For example, I'm sure there were many "good" hypotheses about why the moon was covered with dark areas, or "seas"... right up until October 7, 1959 - when Luna 3 discovered that... it wasn't.

lro_nearside_farside_590.jpg.CROP.original-original.jpg


---------------------- Near Side ------------------------------------------------ Far Side -----------------------

 
Last edited:

aaron_c

Senior Member
Messages
691
Regarding the question about ATP and pyruvate, I believe the problem is that these are not sufficiently bioavailable orally, so supplementing them will have very little effect.

I get energy and then insomnia from too much ATP. I always thought this was because ATP was doing just what I thought it should ie helping my body produce energy, and that, like so many supplements that help with making energy, taking pharmacological doses overwhelmed my body's ability to regulate energy production.

So Dr. Davis' statement on this made me somewhat concerned, because it made me think that the assay, while able to determine whether a cell is producing a decent amount of energy, might not be able to determine whether that pace is ultimately sustainable. Or maybe it just needs more time to do that, I don't know.

But Dr. Davis obviously seems to think this will work as a test, so I probably misunderstood something. Can anyone point out what I'm missing?
 

TreePerson

Senior Member
Messages
292
Location
U.K.
I get energy and then insomnia from too much ATP. I always thought this was because ATP was doing just what I thought it should ie helping my body produce energy, and that, like so many supplements that help with making energy, taking pharmacological doses overwhelmed my body's ability to regulate energy production.

So Dr. Davis' statement on this made me somewhat concerned, because it made me think that the assay, while able to determine whether a cell is producing a decent amount of energy, might not be able to determine whether that pace is ultimately sustainable. Or maybe it just needs more time to do that, I don't know.

But Dr. Davis obviously seems to think this will work as a test, so I probably misunderstood something. Can anyone point out what I'm missing?

I had this thought too. A burst of adrenaline makes my body work for a short period but makes me very ill later. And I wondered how he would be able to test or protect against this sort of thing.
 

ash0787

Senior Member
Messages
308
I would rather try injecting pyruvate than eating ATP or bathing in it, as far as I know it has no other usage in the body than an intermediate energy molecule