CBS protocol question: are fermented foods high in sulfur?

[ebethc]

Hi,

Are fermented foods high in sulfur? I think that I read that somewhere, but I'm not sure..

thanks

 

[ahmo]

Fermented foods are high in histamines. But sauerkraut is high sulfur/thiol.

 

[Gondwanaland]

Sulfites occur naturally in some foods and beverages as a result of fermentation, such as in beer and wine.

I think one can assume that there will be plenty of bacteria capable of generating/increasing the sulfur content of any food in fermentation.

izzy

 

[Critterina]

Sulfur is an element. You can't increase it or decrease it by a fermentation process. A nuclear accelerator might work, but not bacteria, yeast, and the like. Various chemical processes may make it more or less likely to react, but the total amount doesn't change.

 

[Gondwanaland]

Sulfur is an element. You can't increase it or decrease it by a fermentation process. A nuclear accelerator might work, but not bacteria, yeast, and the like. Various chemical processes may make it more or less likely to react, but the total amount doesn't change.

Thanks for the chemistry lesson, Crit!

I had an awful experience when fermenting coconut water with kefir grains. I think the sulfur content turned into sulfite (is it possible?) and then I had to throw away the coconut water, the kefir grains and all my fermented vegetables. This was in March and I have been keeping distance from fermented foods ever since. This is when I bacame salicylate intolerant. I know salicylates don't involve sulfur, but the PST enzyme is surely involved

izzy

 

[ebethc]

@Gondwanaland - is coconut high in sulfur? I've seen it on some list and wonder if it's really high enough to worry about... Giving up dairy is bad enough - I need some good substitutes and coconut works. I would hate to give that up, too. thanks.

 

[Gondwanaland]

@ebethc it contains sulfur but no thiols. My take is if you feel well, keep eating it. Fresh coconut/home made milk and butter are safer (no sulfites added).

izzy

 

[ebethc]

@Gondwanaland - what's the diff between thiols & sulfur? thanks

 

[Gondwanaland]

@Gondwanaland - what's the diff between thiols & sulfur? thanks

Thiols are often referred to as mercaptans.[3][4] The term mercaptan/mərˈkæptæn/[5] is derived from the Latin mercurium captans (capturing mercury)[6] because the thiolate group bonds so strongly with mercury compounds.[7] Thiols react with mercury to form mercaptides.

Since methylation will promote detox, thiols may intensify the process making it unberable and/or may redistribute toxins. Some people may need to avoid them.

 

[Critterina]

@Gondwanaland - what's the diff between thiols & sulfur? thanks

Here's another chemistry lesson for you (because I'm procrastinating about something else):

Starting with sulfur is an element, denoted by the letter S. It can be alone or bound to other elements in a molecule. When you say something has sulfur, you aren't really commenting on what kind of molecule it is in, or whether it's elemental (not bound to anything.)

Thiols are sulfurs connected to a hydrogen and usually a carbon, in this order: -C-S-H. Usually written C-SH (without the dash between the sulfur and the hydrogen.) The C can be part of something else (indicated by the dash before it) and actually, if can be something other than carbon, like nitrogen. My college roomate used to say: "Carbon has four hands. Carbon likes to hold hands." S has two hands (a.k.a. electron orbitals to create bonds with). The S only takes one of C's hands; the other one is taken up by the H. So the carbon is holding on to other things with it's three other hands.

And yes, like @Gondwanaland says, thiols are reactive. I can't say "more reactive than S" because S can be in any configuration, so it can be more or less reactive, depending on what other chemicals are in the molecule. And also, like she say, some people do have trouble with them, for whatever reason. (Personally, I thought the mercaptides were pretty stable, but chemistry was a LONG time ago: 20 years since teaching and believe me, we didn't do thiols in the high school where I taught; 35 years since studying.)

 

[ebethc]

Here's another chemistry lesson for you (because I'm procrastinating about something else):

Starting with sulfur is an element, denoted by the letter S. It can be alone or bound to other elements in a molecule. When you say something has sulfur, you aren't really commenting on what kind of molecule it is in, or whether it's elemental (not bound to anything.)

Thiols are sulfurs connected to a hydrogen and usually a carbon, in this order: -C-S-H. Usually written C-SH (without the dash between the sulfur and the hydrogen.) The C can be part of something else (indicated by the dash before it) and actually, if can be something other than carbon, like nitrogen. My college roomate used to say: "Carbon has four hands. Carbon likes to hold hands." S has two hands (a.k.a. electron orbitals to create bonds with). The S only takes one of C's hands; the other one is taken up by the H. So the carbon is holding on to other things with it's three other hands.

And yes, like @Gondwanaland says, thiols are reactive. I can't say "more reactive than S" because S can be in any configuration, so it can be more or less reactive, depending on what other chemicals are in the molecule. And also, like she say, some people do have trouble with them, for whatever reason. (Personally, I thought the mercaptides were pretty stable, but chemistry was a LONG time ago: 20 years since teaching and believe me, we didn't do thiols in the high school where I taught; 35 years since studying.)

thanks, @Critterina ! What does this mean on a practical level, i.e, if +/+ mutations for all 3 CBS's and 2 BHMT's, then how do you know if sulfur or thiol or both are the culprit?

 

[Critterina]

thanks, @Critterina ! What does this mean on a practical level, i.e, if +/+ mutations for all 3 CBS's and 2 BHMT's, then how do you know if sulfur or thiol or both are the culprit?

Sorry, I don't know any quick way to figure that out. I'm sure we'd need to know which BHMTs they are and what the SUOX status is, too. But I can't decipher it, and I'm probably missing some. So, trial and error is your best bet.