• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

Has anyone tried EECP (Enhanced External Counter Pulsation)

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
16,171
I read in an old post on this forum that Dr. Derek Enlander's office in NY does EECP treatments for CFS. I had never in my life heard of this modality and it sounds very promising. I found a few threads on PR from 2010-2012 in which two PWC's said it helped them dramatically.

I was wondering if anyone else (since 2012) has tried this treatment either with Dr. Enlander or elsewhere in the U.S. or world? I am in L.A. so it is not an option for me to fly to NY but I did some research and there is a center literally five min from me that provides this treatment. Is was designed for angina (not CFS) but is now used to treat a wide variety of conditions.

They said I can do a free consultation and try the treatment (as it is not dangerous) and then get a referral from my doctor if I want to do the full protocol of 35 sessions. I am not sure what my cardiologist will say to this and will also ask my ND.

My fatigue and cardiac symptoms have deteriorated this weekend to the point that I am desperate to try anything that can help me. Any info/thoughts on this treatment would be really appreciated. I know it is not a cure but I will take any improvement that I can get at this point.
 

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
16,171
@Sushi, Could this post be moved to another section where more people might see it? I am really curious to know if anyone on the board knows about EECP before my appt on Thurs. Thanks so much!
 

Sushi

Moderation Resource Albuquerque
Messages
19,935
Location
Albuquerque
@Sushi, Could this post be moved to another section where more people might see it? I am really curious to know if anyone on the board knows about EECP before my appt on Thurs. Thanks so much!

I moved it to "Autonomic, Cardiovascular and Respiratory."

I can comment, but not from personal experience. This was a treatment that was used a great deal more before they perfected cardiac bypass surgery--it was said to help the body create more blood vessels so the blood flow had choices other than blocked arteries.

I don't know of it being used for ME, but if Dr. Enlander has been using it, perhaps it has. Once bypass surgery became common, this technique seemed to go into the "alternative" category.

Sushi
 

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
16,171
@Sushi thank you for moving this post!

I have been researching this treatment as a result of the pioneering work done by Dr Enlander on EECP for CFS and watched some videos on his website. I am on the west coast so not an option for me to see him but I am going to try it here. I will let you guys know how it goes w/my consult on Thurs. I doubt insurance will pay anything for it but what else is new?
 

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
16,171
@Sushi I wanted to give a quick update that I postponed my appt for the EECP b/c I have questions re: whether I am a good candidate due to my tachycardia, etc.

I was able to schedule a phone consult for next week with Dr Enlander so I can discuss it with him (since he is the one who started using this Tx off label for CFS patients.)

If he feels I am a good candidate then I will re-schedule for July which also gives me time to discuss w/my cardiologist.
 

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
16,171
It is so strange to see this thread revived that I had written in 2014 only two weeks after I joined PR! In case it is helpful, I never did try the EECP back at that time (or ever). But the article that you linked @Marylib re: using EECP for Long Covid was very interesting!
 

dave11

Senior Member
Messages
158
I took the full 35 sessions of EECP for the cardiac benefit. The technician running it told me most of the improvement for the heart is in the first two weeks (10 sessions). Perhaps the doctor can tell you how many sessions it usually takes to see if EECP is working for you.
 

dave11

Senior Member
Messages
158
When I took EECP eight years ago, I found out afterwards the cardiologist's office was using older equipment. The newest equipment at that time was much better, and gave the technician detailed information to adjust the pressures and timing to improve performance.

If doing EECP in the future, I would check on the manufacturer's website, or otherwise investigate to be sure the doctor's office is using good equipment.
 

dave11

Senior Member
Messages
158
Did the treatment benefit your ME/CFS symptoms?

I had breathing, pulmonary, and heart related CFS due to blood sugar issues. My problems were not neurological as in ME. So, I do not think my experience is useful for considering EECP's utility for ME. The EECP did help my breathing for a short time after each session by dilating the arteries. I am not sure whether there was a long term benefit for me.
 
Messages
29
I heard one report of a Long Covid patient that got a short 1-2 day improvement after each session, that didn’t last though. This effect might be because of the improved circulation/oxygen flow.
 

Rrrr

Senior Member
Messages
1,591
Hi all,

I’ve been using a leg compression device at home for a 1.5 weeks now with very good results.

The leg compression device looks a lot like what is used in EECP — but unlike EECP the leg compression device I have is not synced to have the inflation and deflation synced with your heart’s activity.

I’m doing 20-60 minutes per session, once or twice a day, on the lowest “intensity” setting.

It’s so easy. You lay down and blood pressure-like cuffs (balloons?) rhythmically inflate and deflate around your legs —all while you watch TV, read a book or work on your laptop.

To my surprise, within days of first using it, I experienced improved sleep, increased energy, increased stamina, increased activity tolerance.

I’m using this device:
ReAthlete Leg Massager
https://a.co/d/h6LO7Fx

The manufacturer sells another version w heat. Not sure if heat would help or hurt.

My ME/CFS healthcare provider says the thinking behind using this device for ME/CFS is from Enhanced external counterpulsation (EECP). Here is some random info on EECP:

https://heart.stonybrookmedicine.edu/health-information/treatments-procedures/eecp

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/External_counterpulsation

Treatments I try rarely improve my ME symptoms, and when they do, the gains can disappear in a few weeks or months. So time will tell with this leg compression device. But for now I’m impressed.

Note: During my first week of using the device, I was doing so well I (of course)
pushed myself too hard (because I could!) and I overdid it.

So I crashed for about five days. Using the device may have still helped during those days, but not a ton.

But after about five days of PEM, then I used the device for longer (this was last night) — it was my first time using it for a *full* hour, just before bed — and it really helped improve my sleep, and today my energy is much improved again.