Just Discovered a CFS Recovery Story Using Anti-Virals (per Lerner)

[Wayne]

I just ran across a remarkable CFS full recovery story (or remission) and thought I'd post a link: Viral CFS- A Possible Cure - MY STORY. I was struck by her initial paragraphs describing what she believes are the causes of many of the symptoms of CFS, which I thought were spot on (her entire post is much longer):

I have posted several times in this forum, but I thought I would share my story, so it would be visible to more people. My hope is that all of the research and time I spent trying to figure out CFS will be helpful to someone else. I also wanted to have only one post to check, so I can come back and answer any questions that people may have. So here goes....

The development of CFS can be triggered by almost anything that puts too much stress on the body, whether it be a bad virus, a coma, a death of a loved one, an auto accident, or over-exercising or training in sports.

http://www.cfids-cab.org/MESA/ccpccd.pdf

Once the autonomous nervous system takes a hit, your entire pituitary-hypothalmic-thyroid-adrenal system goes off line, and it has a cascading effect on your immune system and your hormones.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothalamic–pituitary–adrenal_axis

The misregulation of this system is what causes many of the symptoms of CFS. Once the system is out of whack, your immune system down-regulates which causes any latent infection that you carry within your body, such as any herpes viruses (including simplex 1 &2, varicella, EBV, etc.) or bacteria (mycoplasma, lyme, etc.), to rise up and have a party. The re-activation of these infections causes additional CFS symptoms. Once stuck in this mis-regulation cycle, the body gets stuck and can't get out of it unless there is aggressive and early intervention. ......

 

[anniekim]

Thanks for sharing. There is only one thing I don't understand in her story. She said that when taking the famvir she experienced die off from the killing of bacterial infections, yet earlier she said she had no bacterial infections.

It's a general point that I have never known. We know killing bacterial infections will cause die off from the release of dead bacterial toxins, but I have never known whether killing off virus can also cause toxin release and thus an experience of die off for the patient? Any thoughts most appreciated

It does seem a subset do really well with antivirals and particularly if treated early in the illness

 

[Wayne]

Thanks for sharing. There is only one thing I don't understand in her story. She said that when taking the famvir she experienced die off from the killing of bacterial infections, yet earlier she said she had no bacterial infections.

It's a general point that I have never known. We know killing bacterial infections will cause die off from the release of dead bacterial toxins, but I have never known whether killing off virus can also cause toxin release and thus an experience of die off for the patient? Any thoughts most appreciated.

Hi Anniekim,

Yes, I also did a double take on killing bacterial infections. Regarding dieoff from viruses, I've read references they can sometimes be extreme. My understanding is that just like bacteria, we can have widely varying amounts of viral populations in our system. I can't say for sure this is the case, but it makes sense to me.

 

[SickOfSickness]

It's good to hear about significant improvement. However, out of all the patients who try anti-virals seriously, aren't there many who see little improvement?

Out of the ones who saw less improvement, I would like to know what other treatments they had tried first. How sick they were. A certain level of health may be needed first.

 

[S.A.]

My son (age 15) is on an antiviral to suppress recurrent shingles. I think his inability to clear viruses from his body is definitely a part of his equation, but taking an antiviral is only a small part, a very small part, of his treatment. He may need to eventually up his dosage, since its barely doing the job, but I'm hoping the methylation protocol will eventually reduce his need for it.

I would think antiviral treatment's ability to help would also depend on each individual's genetic makeup and on which viruses each has accumulated.

Recently I also read research information on serrapeptase breaking down biofilm structures in viruses and bacterial infections. I believe that research is on going, but the researchers were looking into ways to make antibiotics and antiviral s more effective.

 

[Snow Leopard]

It's a general point that I have never known. We know killing bacterial infections will cause die off from the release of dead bacterial toxins, but I have never known whether killing off virus can also cause toxin release and thus an experience of die off for the patient? Any thoughts most appreciated

Viral 'die off' doesn't release toxins because viruses don't really contain such, except for the viral proteins (which are are higher levels when the virus is active). There are still two possible consequences. The first is that antivirals don't just target viruses directly, but also have a variety of immunomodulating effects. The second is that in the absence of the virus, the immune state will shift, which could also result in a change in symptoms.

 

[heapsreal]

bacterial die off from antivirals could be related to the IRIS, as viral load decreases then the immune system can go after bacterial infections. Not sure if thats what its meaning but its possible??

 

[Daffodil]

there are several who have recovered with anti-herpetic drugs. my NYC doctor often referred to a patient of his, who, after long-term illness, recovered on acyclovir and went on to become a successful research scientist.

i have posted this before but here is another story of recovery using famvir for 6 years...6th post from the top:

http://forums.bettermedicine.com/showthread.php/15351-quot-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-quot-diagnosed

 

[anniekim]

Thank you for all the very helpful replies to my question. Understand it a lot better now

 

[Wayne]

there are several who have recovered with anti-herpetic drugs. my NYC doctor often referred to a patient of his, who, after long-term illness, recovered on acyclovir and went on to become a successful research scientist. ... i have posted this before but here is another story of recovery using famvir for 6 years...6th post from the top: --- http://forums.bettermedicine.com/showthread.php/15351-quot-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-quot-diagnosed

Daffodil, thanks for posting this link. I thought the original post plus most of the comments were very good. --- @Ema, you might be interested in this as it delves into various thyroid issues.

 

[Ema]

Wow, 6 YEARS on Famvir! That's more than I would have thought for sure...

 

[heapsreal]

Wow, 6 YEARS on Famvir! That's more than I would have thought for sure...

its been about 4 years for me now on famvir and abit over a year on valcyte. I think the ones who can stop av's have immune systems that bounce back for others may have to stay on av's to maintain things if they help??

 

[Daffodil]

yea who knows how some do so well on the antivirals. if it is HERV causing this, as Dr. DeMeirleir suggests, maybe the famvir is removing the trigger for HERV (EBV?). there was a study suggesting that several years of acyclovir might actually eliminate EBV from the body.

perhaps for others, the HERV replication has taken on a life of its own and famvir doesnt work..? ?

 

[RUkiddingME]

Thanks for sharing Wayne!!! I'm experiencing remarkable results on Valcyte as well!