• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

What has helped more with your sleep?

Sparrowhawk

Senior Member
Messages
514
Location
West Coast USA
I tried everything but prescription sleep aids, including acupuncture, Chinese herbs, melatonin, valerian, kava, and combinations of those. Even when they would help me get to sleep I found within three hours I was having disrupted sleep. Often had to take more, and woke exhausted, sometimes worse than the night before. I don't know over time what changed but I decided to do the sleep hygeine thing and made myself go to bed EVERY NIGHT at 8:30, black out shades, and I had nothing exciting at all going on after 5pm if I could help it. Audio books or scrabble or both only between dinner and bed. Then once lights out I do calming meditation body scans and such. I am at the point where I can usually get to sleep within a half hour to forty five minutes doing that.

I still wake frequently, turn over, etc. especially after about 3am. But at least if I get in bed by 8:30 I net enough sleep by 5:40 or 6am to be somewhat human the next day. It makes a huge difference.
 

Beyond

Juice Me Up, Scotty!!!
Messages
1,122
Location
Murcia, Spain
GABA is the only thing that's made a difference to me. I take the pharmaGABA variety which supposedly crosses the blood brain barrier, 250 mg. I still wake up but now I go back to sleep more quickly. And I get deep sleep now which is so nice. Still have a hard time getting out of bed in the morning, but I feel okay once I'm up and moving.
Thanks for your feedback. I have used NOW and Kirkmans GABA, both of them pretty useless. Wish I tried the pharmaGABA instead! Will probably try it now. When you are this desperate is absurd not to try things.

Now is my turn. What I have found to help my sleep? Waking up early everyday and earthing did the trick for some months. For me, waking up early will mean an earlier onset of sleep, and waking up later will make a later onset of sleep. It does work somewhat so my cyrcadian rhythm isn´t completely dead. All this time I was waking up very early 8 AM or so. Sleep hygiene does have an effect even with melatonin and GABA defficiencies, for me at least.

What has happened recently is that one day I woke up at 7 as usual but rolled back to sleep til 9, next day because of later sleep onset at night until 11 and today until 14:00 (lunch time). A vicious cycle. I indulged in waking up later and now I am screwed and it feels like earthing no longer works. I guess I could be trying getting up early no matter what hour I fell asleep but that sounds like a very very bad day... And there is no guarantee it will work...

All this does not make a dent in getting more refreshing sleep by the way. It just makes the torture of being awake in your bed at midnight for hours dissapear, which is something. And I look and feel slightly better when I sleep at the "correct" hours.
 
Last edited:

*GG*

senior member
Messages
6,389
Location
Concord, NH
The only thing that has ever helped me sleep is Trazodone. But even with that I wake almost like clockwork at 3 a.m. I actually feel pretty ok with this. The few times I've slept straight through, and wake around 5:30 a.m I feel like garbage.

I've been trying on and off for years to try to find a lot of other things to try. Nothing OTC has helped at all and so far I'm batting zero with RX's. They either drug me or make me feel like I"m on speed.

Someone on another forum said the funniest thing about sleep. He said "I make chamomile tea in a cast iron teapot and then bash myself in the skull with it." Hahaha I still laugh every time I read that!

@minkeygirl I used Trazadone for years also, I did not sleep thru the night with it either, Dr then prescribed Doxepin. Did not work at all for me! Then tried Mitrazapine (Remeron) for over 3 years and still working very well, had a night of insmnia this week, but finally feel and stayed asleep.

GG
 

August59

Daughters High School Graduation
Messages
1,617
Location
Upstate SC, USA
There is a new version of Ambien on the market. It is for people that wake up around 3am or 4am or still have 4 hours to sleep. It is a sublingual medication and it is 3.5mg for females and 5mg for males. It suppose to work extremely quick and clears your system very fast.

There are 2 versions I think, but the one that I know that is on the market in the US is called Intermezzo. In the UK it is called Edular and comes in 5mg and 10mg sublingual. I bet that sublingual 10mg would get you to sleep fast! There was talk on a sleep forum about some people cutting them in half, so you could possible end p with a 1.75mg dose if you had the opportunity to get a script for 3.5 mg and they would last you twice as long and 1.75mg is a very small dose for Ambien. It is a very individual drug though as I have taken 10mg normal or the 12.5mg long acting, but found no difference in either one, then you have some that can't take 5mg and then there's the ones that take 20mg every night without any side effects.

I've tried Xyrem 3 different times and it was only better than Ambien because you can take 2 doses per night of the Xyrem and get at least 6 hours of sleep and usually a little more, whereas Ambien will get me 5 hours max, but most of the time it is about 4 hours.
 

heapsreal

iherb 10% discount code OPA989,
Messages
10,089
Location
australia (brisbane)
There is a new version of Ambien on the market. It is for people that wake up around 3am or 4am or still have 4 hours to sleep. It is a sublingual medication and it is 3.5mg for females and 5mg for males. It suppose to work extremely quick and clears your system very fast.

There are 2 versions I think, but the one that I know that is on the market in the US is called Intermezzo. In the UK it is called Edular and comes in 5mg and 10mg sublingual. I bet that sublingual 10mg would get you to sleep fast! There was talk on a sleep forum about some people cutting them in half, so you could possible end p with a 1.75mg dose if you had the opportunity to get a script for 3.5 mg and they would last you twice as long and 1.75mg is a very small dose for Ambien. It is a very individual drug though as I have taken 10mg normal or the 12.5mg long acting, but found no difference in either one, then you have some that can't take 5mg and then there's the ones that take 20mg every night without any side effects.

I've tried Xyrem 3 different times and it was only better than Ambien because you can take 2 doses per night of the Xyrem and get at least 6 hours of sleep and usually a little more, whereas Ambien will get me 5 hours max, but most of the time it is about 4 hours.

Have u tried zopiclone or the equivilent to it over there, lunesta maybe, i find it gives me a couple extra hours then ambien.

Im finding the traditional sleep meds are only helping me initiate sleep and need to use an antihistamine or sedating ad to increase sleep length.

Tizanidine i have found good for me for those middle of the night awakenings as they have a very short life, so if i need to be awake in say 2-3 hrs then they are helpful. I will also use them occassionally during the day if i need a nap badly as i had crap sleep the night before. I seem to have lost my ability to have a short nap during the day if i need it. tizanidine can help me get a one hour nanna nap.

Instead of the quick acting ambien, have u thought of just using half of a regular ambien and letting it disolve under your tongue??

We're always chasing our tails with sleep, im sure we have something broken which controls sleep.

cheers!!!
 

maryb

iherb code TAK122
Messages
3,602
Location
UK
GABA is the only thing that's made a difference to me. I take the pharmaGABA variety which supposedly crosses the blood brain barrier, 250 mg. I still wake up but now I go back to sleep more quickly. And I get deep sleep now which is so nice. Still have a hard time getting out of bed in the morning, but I feel okay once I'm up and moving.

Which brand do you use? I have extremely high morning cortisol so wondering if this may work? iherb have it on at a good price at present - Source Naturals brand.
 

Plum

Senior Member
Messages
512
Location
UK
Controlling blood sugar. I eat Paleo. Have a sugar substitute in my tea and don't really eat puddings etc. Have found taking sugar out of my tea and reducing carb (potato) at dinner helps. I can only manage 1/2 a medium potato.

Wake on average 2 times per night to pee. Brain gets all active - negative thoughts, nightmares etc. Remedy this by watching Simpsons or nature programs - helps me fall asleep quicker! Distracts my brain enough.
 

Beyond

Juice Me Up, Scotty!!!
Messages
1,122
Location
Murcia, Spain
Mary, the brand of pharmaGABA is actually Natural Factors. The other GABA I am afraid doesn´t seem to work for me. I am gonna try that, sublingual melatonin and sleep hygiene.
 

minkeygirl

But I Look So Good.
Messages
4,678
Location
Left Coast
@minkeygirl I used Trazadone for years also, I did not sleep thru the night with it either, Dr then prescribed Doxepin. Did not work at all for me! Then tried Mitrazapine (Remeron) for over 3 years and still working very well, had a night of insmnia this week, but finally feel and stayed asleep.

GG

Doxepin did nothing for me either. I'm hesitant to try Remeron because almost everyone that takes it gains weight, a LOT of weight. It's on my list of things to try to switch off with.

When my brain is going nothing helps me sleep.
 

minkeygirl

But I Look So Good.
Messages
4,678
Location
Left Coast
Mary, the brand of pharmaGABA is actually Natural Factors. The other GABA I am afraid doesn´t seem to work for me. I am gonna try that, sublingual melatonin and sleep hygiene.

@maryb I tried Pharma Gaba and it didn't help at all. I think you are like me and most OTC stuff doesn't touch our level of insomnia.
 

minkeygirl

But I Look So Good.
Messages
4,678
Location
Left Coast
That sucks minkeygirl. I will try though is just 13 bucks.

When I tried it a few years ago it was about $30. My level of "insomnia" is so bad nothing OTC helps me and I've tried pretty much everything. Some of us just need drugs.

Mink
 

maryb

iherb code TAK122
Messages
3,602
Location
UK
@Beyond
I just checked - it was natural factors I was looking at:confused:
oh I wish we had a local try before you buy group - can I face another supplement in my cupboards - unused......
 

Beyond

Juice Me Up, Scotty!!!
Messages
1,122
Location
Murcia, Spain
Hah maryb, it has taken me and my family YEARS to finish most of the unused supplements in the kitchen. :( :rolleyes: :D My mother got the impression that NOTHING works after so much buying but personally I have found some things DO work. Is just that a lot of supplements simply don´t work and some things are easier to improve than others...

The sicker you are the harder to feel something (positive) from supplements. I would say 25% of things I have taken in my life worked, is a pretty poor percentage, and some of these made me feel worse (I prefer that to not feeling anything, at least it gives you clues).

BTW, sleep hygiene... Today slept 6,5 hours to wake up earlier and I have a debilitating headache. Buuuhhhh.
 
Last edited:

heapsreal

iherb 10% discount code OPA989,
Messages
10,089
Location
australia (brisbane)
Doxepin did nothing for me either. I'm hesitant to try Remeron because almost everyone that takes it gains weight, a LOT of weight. It's on my list of things to try to switch off with.

When my brain is going nothing helps me sleep.

Just alternate the remeron a couple of nights a week with the traz, this helps avoid weight gain side effects as well as tolerance to both meds, hopefully??

cheers!!
 

maryb

iherb code TAK122
Messages
3,602
Location
UK
@Beyond
ahhh I only do sleep hygiene one way - I go to bed at the same time every night but not so in the moring - I stay in bed if I can - but sometimes feel too bad with head pressure and get up, I couldn't get into daytime routine as my sleep is so erratic. Having said that though my usual time for getting up is roughly 9am give or take half an hour- since the clocks went back a week ago I've been up at 8am and felt knackered, so my body does try to stick to a clock on its own obviously. A couple of mornings I've been so tired and slept 'til 10am, but felt so much better for it. Sleep deprivation is the worst thing - my ME doc said I'll never get better if I don't sleep...........:(