Fed up of waking up every night at 3 am

[A zombie]

high cortisol is just as bad as low, Mary B.
Mine is high at night and it prevents me from going to sleep. i take cortisol manager , plus gaba and melotonin and i've been catching SOME zzzzzz's lately. I also started LDN almost 2 weeks ago--- it's an rx that is supposed to calm the immune system for ppl with auto immune disease. It's supposed to help with sleep, becuz it calms the system.
Check out cortisol manger to take throughout the day to lower your cortisol. Didn't your dr give you any recommendations??

 

[minkeygirl]

I also started LDN almost 2 weeks ago--- it's an rx that is supposed to calm the immune system for ppl with auto immune disease. It's supposed to help with sleep, becuz it calms the system.

When I took LDN it kept me up all night.

 

[maryb]

MeSci
thats exactly what happens to me - awake unti 7am and then grab an hour or two more when I can.
with these a/histamines I go back to sleep straight away, where do you get the chlorphenamine from?My diet is good but I can't tolerate many supplements

 

[minkeygirl]

I have a problem, one I wake about 4 a.m. my trazodone won't work then. I have an muscle relaxant but that takes an hour to knock me out. I'll have to see if that works when I know I won't get back to sleep, like today.

maryb have you tried Amazon for the chlorphenamine maleate? They have it there.

 

[heapsreal]

hi heapsreal,

I use 1/2 of zolpidem. A full dose gives me brainfog and more headache the next day. Should I take the antihistamine when I go to sleep or when I wake up?

I use the antihistamine when i go to sleep with my zopi, i suppose its a trial and error. taking it at 3am may leave u with a hangover, tizanadine with a short half life would be ok to take at 3am??

 

[minkeygirl]

I have been experimenting with tizanidine. It takes about an hour for it to kick in and then puts me to sleep for about 3 hours. I also found if I fight the drowsy feeling it takes longer for me to fall asleep.

What I do like is there is no drug hangover whatsoever. I'm going to try it when I wake at 3 a.m. I tried it before and it didn't put me to sleep.

I also tried Seroquel. 50 mgs had me drugged for 24 hours. Not sure if a lower dose would have different results but I"ll try that when I don't have anything to do one day.

 

[maddietod]

I have a friend taking clonozapam, doxepin, and magnesium glycinate at night. She calls it 'Cheney's protocol;' apparently he believes these are synergistic. She's getting 7 hours straight sleep, which for her is miraculous.

She has also taken LDN in the past, and recommends that if I try it, I take it in the morning at first (for sleep at night) to test my response.

 

[minkeygirl]

I have a friend taking clonozapam, doxepin, and magnesium glycinate at night.

This is why we are all different. Doxepin drugs me out no matter how low the dose, I can't take benzos because I like them too much (took 4 months to get off 1 mg klonopin and didn't sleep for a year after that) and magnesium does nothing for me.

 

[*GG*]

I've a little supplement for every deficiency and symptom which is about 50 boxes

However I haven't found any remedy to stop waking up every night at 3 am. It must be my adrenals or liver that spike because I wake up to go to the bathroom again and again. Of course I run out of pipi in the end but the urge is always there. And then I'm awake, unable to fall asleep till 6 am, about the time hubby has to wake up. Aaarghh. Then the kids wake up at 7am. Aaaaaarghh again.

So any advice to make my adrenals and bladder fall asleep at night are welcome.

PS: I do take a sleeping pill; it works till 3 am.

I take Mirtazapine, and it has been working well for me for over 3 years now! (it's an anti-depressant, but I take it to help put me and keep me asleep. FYI

GG

 

[MeSci]

MeSci
thats exactly what happens to me - awake unti 7am and then grab an hour or two more when I can.
with these a/histamines I go back to sleep straight away, where do you get the chlorphenamine from?My diet is good but I can't tolerate many supplements

I get Boots' own brand, which is cheaper than Piriton (the most well-known UK brand), but I'm sure most pharmacists sell it, as well as various online places.

Re problems with the delay in effects that some people mention, I need to take diphenhydramine and chlorphenamine about 3 hours before bed, and promethazine or melatonin about 4 hours before bed. If I need something fast-acting for those early-morning awakenings, I find (paracetamol and) codeine best.

 

[heapsreal]

i also had some success with high dose tryptophan 3000mg when waking at 3am, usually the stomache is empty so its absorbed relatively quickly and no hangover.

There was another Z drug(sonata) brought to the market around the same time as ambien/zolpidem and it had a very short half life of an hour and was marketed for sleep onset issues and was also said to be good for middle of the night awakenings also as it was out of the system within a couple of hours. Maybe sonata/zaleplon wasnt as popular as many found zolpidem was enough. Its not sold in australia so i cant really give a review.

 

[MeSci]

i also had some success with high dose tryptophan 3000mg when waking at 3am, usually the stomache is empty so its absorbed relatively quickly and no hangover.

Related to tryptophan is 5-HTP. The Channel Isles-based company Healthspan do a nighttime compound based on this called Sweet Dreams. I haven't tried it but a lot of people seem to find it beneficial.

There are some rather dire warnings about 5-HTP here but I am not convinced that they are merited.

There is more-detailed info here.

 

[heapsreal]

Related to tryptophan is 5-HTP. The Channel Isles-based company Healthspan do a nighttime compound based on this called Sweet Dreams. I haven't tried it but a lot of people seem to find it beneficial.

There are some rather dire warnings about 5-HTP here but I am not convinced that they are merited.

There is more-detailed info here.

I have used both trypto and 5htp, i just found trypto better for sleep, both improve mood though.
I think theres enough people who have used 5htp without issues to show that its safe for the majority.

 

[Beyond]

Must be adrenals. I have very low adrenal hormones and often I wake up in the middle of the night, rarely really awake and unable to fall asleep easily. I have noticed that eating something right before going to bed seems to decrease awakenings. Oh and stopping gluten and casein, believe it or not, has decreased A LOT the number of night-wakings.

 

[Valentijn]

I take Mirtazapine, and it has been working well for me for over 3 years now! (it's an anti-depressant, but I take it to help put me and keep me asleep.

That's one I was looking at recently, when searching for substances which inhibit ADRA2A, something which gets extremely overexpressed in ME/CFS patients after exertion and can cause some ME/CFS symptoms. It turns out the up-regulated ADRA2A can cause norepinephrine to drop, which might explain my otherwise inexplicable low levels in that area.

Then I realized my mom's 20 year old cat takes Mirtazapine to stimulate her appetite. It also inhibits the serotonin receptors, and a histamine receptor.

I've ended up trying Yohimbine (yohimbe extract) for some PEM and OI symptoms instead, since it's the most potent ADRA2A inhibitor, and is cheaply available without a prescription.

 

[SOC]

I have a problem, one I wake about 4 a.m. my trazodone won't work then. I have an muscle relaxant but that takes an hour to knock me out. I'll have to see if that works when I know I won't get back to sleep, like today.

Trazodone, as a sleep maintenance agent, has made a huge improvement in my ability to sleep through without waking frequently. However, if I have muscle aches or coughing, those will wake me anyway and if I'm past the main period of effectiveness of the trazodone, then getting back to sleep is a problem.

For a long time my doc had me routinely taking something mild (OTC pain meds) for muscle pain at bedtime to avoid the possibility of muscle pain/tightness waking me. For the coughing, I take a tessalon perle at bedtime to try to head off waking from coughing -- if I've been coughing during the day.

A sleep trick a friend told me sometimes works for me if I'm still within the effectiveness time of the trazodone. She suggested having some sounds -- music, audiobooks, environmental sounds -- playing every night (on a timer) when I fall asleep. Then, if I wake up in the night, I put the sound on again. It has to be a consistent sound -- always music, or always someone talking. Apparently, it can create a habit-like reaction in the brain. You brain will make the connection between the sound and falling asleep so returning to sleep is easier. This trick is completely useless for ordinary sleep induction and maintenance, but with the trazodone it does help with occasional nighttime wakings.

 

[minkeygirl]

Even with the trazodone I almost always wake at 3 a.m. I take another 50 mgs and go right back to sleep, but if I wake at 4 a.m., forget it. Nothing I take works to get me back to sleep, I think because my brain is in high gear.

I also have a machine I got years ago that makes the sound of waves which I have to have on to get to sleep. However if I wake in the middle of the night, it annoys me to no end. Same with the TV.

I should will my brain to science. See if they can figure it out! LOL

Mink

 

[SOC]

Related to tryptophan is 5-HTP. The Channel Isles-based company Healthspan do a nighttime compound based on this called Sweet Dreams. I haven't tried it but a lot of people seem to find it beneficial.

There are some rather dire warnings about 5-HTP here but I am not convinced that they are merited.

There is more-detailed info here.

One thing people do need to be careful about with tryptophan and 5-htp is serotonin syndrome. It's not likely ordinarily, but quite likely in people already taking medications that increase serotonin. Such medications include many (most? all?) antidepressants including those used as sleep aids or pain controllers. I would be extremely cautious about using tryptophan and 5-htp along with those meds.

 

[SOC]

Even with the trazodone I almost always wake at 3 a.m. I take another 50 mgs and go right back to sleep, but if I wake at 4 a.m., forget it. Nothing I take works to get me back to sleep, I think because my brain is in high gear.

I also have a machine I got years ago that makes the sound of waves which I have to have on to get to sleep. However if I wake in the middle of the night, it annoys me to no end. Same with the TV.

I should will my brain to science. See if they can figure it out! LOL

Mink

LOL! One likes to think our brains would be useful for something.

Have you tried increasing your bedtime dose of trazodone? If you're taking enough, you shouldn't be waking routinely unless something like pain is waking you. One of trazodone's greatest qualities for sleep, IMO, is its ability to improve stages 3 and 4 sleep. If you're waking at 4 am, it sounds like the trazodone is wearing off too soon, which is why I'm wondering if you need a higher dose.

 

[MeSci]

Related to tryptophan is 5-HTP. The Channel Isles-based company Healthspan do a nighttime compound based on this called Sweet Dreams. I haven't tried it but a lot of people seem to find it beneficial.

There are some rather dire warnings about 5-HTP here but I am not convinced that they are merited.

There is more-detailed info here.

In case anyone wants to search for the Healthspan 5-HTP products, the names have
changed - they are now called '5-HTP 100mg' and 'Night Time 5-HTP'.
http://www.healthspan.co.uk/wellbeing/5-htp-100mg