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D-ribose - can it make you feel bad?

Allyson

Senior Member
Messages
1,684
Location
Australia, Melbourne
Glad you had good effects - having seen Amazon reviews of D-ribose and read Dr Myhill and others on it, a lot of PWME seem to do well on it.

Maybe I pushed it too fast - I'll keep the highly expensive jar in the cupboard and maybe have another go in a couple of months.

snowathlete - looks like it's maybe, 'start low, go slow'...

yes Sasha,

I noted no ill effects but i was SO gald to get relief form the constant aches

- it is cheaper at iherb - 27 dollars still a lot though

some people - i have read - it gives more energy though i never heard anyone say that
it did not do that for me alas.

it is yummy though so i just use it like sugar - a change from all those yuk meds!
 

soxfan

Senior Member
Messages
995
Location
North Carolina
I just started D-Ribose a week ago. I am currently using only one scoop in the morning and then will go up to another scoop at lunch. I don't feel anything at all...good or bad. Maybe once I get up to the 2nd dose I will. I did try it years ago and didn't notice anything at 3X a day but decided to give it another try....
Mine is a powder that I put into liquid and drink....
 

GhostGum

Senior Member
Messages
316
Location
Vic, AU
it is yummy though so i just use it like sugar - a change from all those yuk meds!

What brand are you using? A little while ago I noticed the smell and taste of the Now d-ribose had changed, it went from a nice brown sugar like smell and taste to an almost rubbing alcohol/metho type smell and taste which was terrible; turned out their manufacturer changed their recipe, probably to save a few bucks. I ended up changing brands but can not find that lovely old sweet sugary stuff.

Sorry it did not work out too well for you Sasha. I have also found it quite useful for muscle soreness.
 

Lotus97

Senior Member
Messages
2,041
Location
United States
What brand are you using? A little while ago I noticed the smell and taste of the Now d-ribose had changed, it went from a nice brown sugar like smell and taste to an almost rubbing alcohol/metho type smell and taste which was terrible; turned out their manufacturer changed their recipe, probably to save a few bucks. I ended up changing brands but can not find that lovely old sweet sugary stuff.
I think all the brands have that smell because they all use Bioenergy Ribose® I tried NutraBio's ribose because I thought it would be different, but it also has the same smell. I didn't think they used Bioenergy though (?)
 

Sasha

Fine, thank you
Messages
17,863
Location
UK
I think all the brands have that smell because they all use Bioenergy Ribose® I tried NutraBio's ribose because I thought it would be different, but it also has the same smell. I didn't think they used Bioenergy though (?)

Mine is by Deluxe Nutrition and it smells a bit like caramel in the tub - I was drinking it mixed in with other stuff so I can't attest to the flavour.
 

Marlène

Senior Member
Messages
443
Location
Edegem, Belgium
I started to use it about 10 days ago, 3 teaspoons a day. At first I did not notice much, so I stopped after 5-6 days.

Then I changed tactics. I now take a teaspoon AFTER exercise and my muscles recover much quicker!
 

perchance dreamer

Senior Member
Messages
1,691
For me, the brand of ribose makes a big difference. I got only a weak energy effect from a full dose of Carlsons and Corvalen when I took them a long time ago. I seem to remember that Carlsons is 3 grams, and Corvalen is 5 grams. It really wasn't enough to make it worth taking. I didn't have any side effects.

After that I got Jarrow powdered ribose. A full dose is 1/2 tsp, 2 grams. The one time I took the full dose (in the morning) I had great energy, but sleep that night was hopeless. After experimenting, I found I can only take 1/64 tsp. of Jarrow ribose without it affecting my sleep.

My nutritionist told me his wife had the same reaction to Jarrow ribose. However, if you look at Iherb and Amazon reviews, it seems that loads of people do great with Jarrow.
 

Lotus97

Senior Member
Messages
2,041
Location
United States
For me, the brand of ribose makes a big difference. I got only a weak energy effect from a full dose of Carlsons and Corvalen when I took them a long time ago. I seem to remember that Carlsons is 3 grams, and Corvalen is 5 grams. It really wasn't enough to make it worth taking. I didn't have any side effects.

After that I got Jarrow powdered ribose. A full dose is 1/2 tsp, 2 grams. The one time I took the full dose (in the morning) I had great energy, but sleep that night was hopeless. After experimenting, I found I can only take 1/64 tsp. of Jarrow ribose without it affecting my sleep.

My nutritionist told me his wife had the same reaction to Jarrow ribose. However, if you look at Iherb and Amazon reviews, it seems that loads of people do great with Jarrow.
Jarrow uses Bioenergy Ribose like most brands, but I don't see anything about Carlson or Corvalen using Bioenergy. On Corvalen it says "Bioenergy Life Science", but that might be a coincidence because I don't see the trademark Bioenergy Ribose® on Corvalen. Most other brands use Bioenergy so I can't imagine them being different than Jarrow's. It's just that the other two you tried happened to be ones made by other suppliers.

I've also heard of people having hypersensitivity to carnitine, adenosylcobalamin, coenzyme q10/ubiquinol, biotin, and maybe a few others. So after hearing what happened to you and Dreambirdie with D-ribose it seems that certain ATP/Krebs supplements might have that effect on people. It's possible you need to do other things first to get your Krebs cycle functioning properly before you can tolerate some of the other supplements. I don't know much about this, but based on some of the things I've heard from others about this it might be true.
 

perchance dreamer

Senior Member
Messages
1,691
I think you're probably right, Lotus. Both carnitine (other than GPLC) and biotin cause me sleep problems. I'll look into the Krebs cycle thing. Thanks.
 

Lotus97

Senior Member
Messages
2,041
Location
United States
I think you're probably right, Lotus. Both carnitine (other than GPLC) and biotin cause me sleep problems. I'll look into the Krebs cycle thing. Thanks.
A good place to start would be the B vitamins. Those along with the other vitamins and minerals are basic building blocks for so many functions in the body. I had problems with biotin too and this is what Jeffrez and dbkita told me:
I think what's more often the case is that if there's any cell toxicity (heavy metals, etc.) or lack of intracellular carnitine or other energy co-factors, or a lack of downstream resources (cortisol, thyroid hormone, etc.), pumping in biotin just cranks up the system way too much and then it crashes. Biotin in many cases is probably better left until most other things are sorted out, especially if you're already crashing from it!
Biotin stimulates the main anaplerotic reaction for the Krebs cycle. This is big in liver gluconeogenesis. Btw it is also the cofactor for the succinyl COA chain (different point in that path where adb12 also works I believe).

Think of an anaplerotic reaction as a backdoor to replenish an intermediate in the Krebs cycle. This however is an important one. It takes one ATP, but if the rest of the Krebs cycle is working it will of course make multiple ATP molecules (the whole point of the Krebs cycle).

The front door is pyruvate to acetyl COA via pyruvate dehydrogenase and then into the Krebs cycle. Pyruvate dehydrogenase needs TPP. Got that mixed with biotin in the previous post. Carnitine plays a big role in loading the front door of course, as to some extent alpha lipoic acid. We also should not forget COQ10 that manages the electron transport chain.

So I agree with Jeffrez that without a functioning Krebs cycle, too much backloading via anaplerotic reactions will just spin things up and maybe cause an energy spike. Before taking adb12 I used to not be able to tolerate much biotin as I would have almost akin to a sugar crash. But now I take 2000 mcg a day as it is beneficial. I am even thinking of moving that up, but I plan to introduce L-carnitine and try pantethine first.
 

Lotus97

Senior Member
Messages
2,041
Location
United States
According to this study, getting Krebs and ATP should actually help sleep (rather than interfere with sleep)
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/09/100914100302.htm#
The researchers documented how ATP (adenosine triphosphate), the fundamental energy currency of cells, is released by active brain cells to start the molecular events leading to sleep. The ATP then binds to a receptor responsible for cell processing and the release of cytokines, small signaling proteins involved in sleep regulation.
By charting the link between ATP and the sleep regulatory substances, the researchers have found the way in which the brain keeps track of activity and ultimately switches from a wakeful to sleeping state. For example, learning and memory depend on changing the connections between brain cells. The study shows that ATP is the signal behind those changes.
The finding reinforces a view developed by Krueger and his colleagues that sleep is a "local phenomenon, that bits and pieces of the brain sleep" depending on how they've been used.
The link between sleep, brain cell activity and ATP has many practical consequences, Krueger said.
For example:
  • The study provides a new set of targets for potential medications. Drugs designed to interact with the receptors ATP binds to may prove useful as sleeping pills.
  • Sleep disorders like insomnia can be viewed as being caused by some parts of the brain being awake while other parts are asleep, giving rise to new therapies.
  • ATP-related blood flow observed in brain-imaging studies can be linked to activity and sleep.
  • Researchers can develop strategies by which specific brain cell circuits are oriented to specific tasks, slowing fatigue by allowing the used parts of the brain to sleep while one goes about other business. It may also clear the way for stroke victims to put undamaged regions of their brains to better use.
  • Brain cells cultured outside the body can be used to study brain cell network oscillations between sleep-like and wake-like states, speeding the progress of brain studies
 

rlc

Senior Member
Messages
822
Hi Sasha, D ribose is naturally made by the body, but unfortunately this is a slow process. When people have a chronic disease, this wears out the Mitochondria, which leads to a need for more D ribose then the body can produce, which is why so many people feel better when they take it.

However D-Ribose lowers blood sugar see http://www.bioenergy.com/pdf/mf/sl/Ribose%20&%20Blood%20Sugar/Ribose_Blood%20Sugar_Science%20070303.pdf

This slight lower of blood sugar is not enough to cause major side effects in anyone, unless they already have a condition that lowers blood sugar (hypoglycemia). Hypoglycemia is caused by many conditions such as diabetes, pre diabetes, pancreatic disease, liver and renal diseases and other endocrine disorders and medications etc. A full list of its causes are found here http://en.diagnosispro.com/differential_diagnosis-for/vegetative-autonomic-endocrine-disorders-hypoglycemia-causes/10859-154-220.html there are 222 possible causes, if you have any failed test results though, this diagnostic software program will be able to reduce the number of possibilities very quickly.

As far as medical science knows at the moment, someone already having a condition that causes hypoglycemia is the only cause of serious side effects with D ribose.

Candida will of course get worse if someone consumes large amounts of sugar, however if your health has declined so much, in such a short period of time, with what is a relatively small increase in sugar, I doubt that Candida is the cause of the problem.

So although the experience of taking D-Ribose has been less then pleasant, Because D ribose it is a product that people with diseases that cause hypoglycemia shouldn’t take, because it will make them sicker, it gives what might turn out to be a very useful clue, to help find what is causing at least a part, if not all of your health problems, which may turn out to be very treatable.

My opinion is that you should stay off the D ribose, and instead go and see your doctor, and get them to do the tests for hypoglycemia. For UK patient this always seems to come with the problem of UK GPs seeing people who have been diagnosed with ME (often Misdiagnosed) as having a psychiatric disease. You can take the information on this site to your doctor about the blood sugar lower affect of D ribose, in diabetics and people with liver disease see http://www.bioenergy.com/pdf/mf/sl/Ribose%20&%20Blood%20Sugar/Ribose_Blood%20Sugar_Science%20070303.pdf

Not sure if the situation has changed but many labs have been using out of date reference ranges for tests for hypoglycemia.

The fasting plasma glucose should be <100 mg/dl (5.5 mmol/l).

Postprandial plasma glucose should be <140 mg/dl (7.7 mmol/l)at 30-minute, 60-minute, 90-minute, and 120-minute. See http://www.bmj.com/rapid-response/2011/11/01/myth-chronic-fatgue-syndrome this test is explained here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postprandial_glucose_test

If these tests show Hypoglycemia, then the next step is finding the cause and treating it.

Hope this helps

All the best
 

Sasha

Fine, thank you
Messages
17,863
Location
UK
As far as medical science knows at the moment, someone already having a condition that causes hypoglycemia is the only cause of serious side effects with D ribose.

Hi rlc - that was really good of you to write such a detailed post!

I didn't feel that my symptoms were those of hypoglaecemia, though - no weakness or shakiness - I just felt as though someone had taken my batteries out. It felt like an absence of energy.
 

Little Bluestem

All Good Things Must Come to an End
Messages
4,930
I take 100 mg or 1/4 teaspoon of Ribose 4 - 5 times/day, always with food or it will give me low blood sugar. It does not make me feel more energetic, but I tire less quickly/have more stamina (for a person with ME).

I take Nature's Plus which says that it contains RiboCell, a trademark of Nutratech, Inc.
 

rlc

Senior Member
Messages
822
Hi Sasha, re

I didn't feel that my symptoms were those of hypoglaecemia, though - no weakness or shakiness - I just felt as though someone had taken my batteries out. It felt like an absence of energy.

Hypoglycemia symptoms depend on the severity of the hypoglycemia, it will cause fatigue (absense of energy) the more severe symptoms like sweating and shaking are normally associated with severe hypoglycemia, it is also possible that if you have a disease that is lower your blood sugar, that the sudden increase in your sugar levels with D ribose is agrevateing the underlying disease.

Like I say low blood sugar is the only known reason that I have ever seen for bad reactions to D ribose, so it could turn out to be a important clue, so if your doctor will test your glucose levels (which they should have done anyway), if they are high this should then lead to finding the cause and treatment.

If your glucose levels are normal, then I guess medical science has missed something.

All the best, Sasha hope feel better soon.
 

Sasha

Fine, thank you
Messages
17,863
Location
UK
Hi Sasha, re



Hypoglycemia symptoms depend on the severity of the hypoglycemia, it will cause fatigue (absense of energy) the more severe symptoms like sweating and shaking are normally associated with severe hypoglycemia, it is also possible that if you have a disease that is lower your blood sugar, that the sudden increase in your sugar levels with D ribose is agrevateing the underlying disease.

Like I say low blood sugar is the only known reason that I have ever seen for bad reactions to D ribose, so it could turn out to be a important clue, so if your doctor will test your glucose levels (which they should have done anyway), if they are high this should then lead to finding the cause and treatment.

If your glucose levels are normal, then I guess medical science has missed something.

All the best, Sasha hope feel better soon.

Thanks - something to look into!
 

snowathlete

Senior Member
Messages
5,374
Location
UK
If your glucose levels are normal, then I guess medical science has missed something.

(Accepting that mitochondrial dysfunction isn't fully proven in ME/CFS yet) Isn't it already widely accepted that mitochondrial dysfunction can lead to oxidatative stress? And therefore if we have mitochondrial dysfunction than suplementing with ribose could, perhaps, lead to an increase in that damage. Which would make you feel pretty awful.
 

Lotus97

Senior Member
Messages
2,041
Location
United States
The fasting plasma glucose should be <100 mg/dl (5.5 mmol/l).

Postprandial plasma glucose should be <140 mg/dl (7.7 mmol/l)at 30-minute, 60-minute, 90-minute, and 120-minute. See http://www.bmj.com/rapid-response/2011/11/01/myth-chronic-fatgue-syndrome this test is explained here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postprandial_glucose_test

If these tests show Hypoglycemia, then the next step is finding the cause and treating it.

Hope this helps

All the best
Hmmm. My fasting glucose was 87, but the lab says the range was 74-106. What's going on? I've had hypoglycemic symptoms for the past 15 years, but every time I was tested they told me I wasn't hypo. In the past the doctors didn't tell me the test results. Thankfully my doctor sends me print-outs of all me tests. Doesn't do me much good though if the reference ranges are bogus. Is this a common problem among tests' reference ranges? Or is the hypo one an anomaly?
 

Sushi

Moderation Resource Albuquerque
Messages
19,935
Location
Albuquerque
Hmmm. My fasting glucose was 87, but the lab says the range was 74-106. What's going on? I've had hypoglycemic symptoms for the past 15 years, but every time I was tested they told me I wasn't hypo. In the past the doctors didn't tell me the test results. Thankfully my doctor sends me print-outs of all me tests. Doesn't do me much good though if the reference ranges are bogus. Is this a common problem among tests' reference ranges? Or is the hypo one an anomaly?

I think 87 is fine for fasting glucose. The range my lab gives is 60 - 100. My morning, fasting glucose is normal but when I did the 3 hour glucose tolerance test, it dropped to 4o. You really need more than morning, fasting glucose to check for hypoglycemia.

Sushi