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Gestalt's Genova, 23andMe & Yasko Methylation genetic results

Beyond

Juice Me Up, Scotty!!!
Messages
1,122
Location
Murcia, Spain
Thanks a lot for responding man, this is such an important thing to me, I have come to weight 125 lbs with 5,9 feets tall and I have lots of tests proving lots of my problems are originating in the leaky gut as you discovered by yourself. The brainfog right now its considerable looking at my repeating of the word "lot" I get this word repeating worse when in brainfog and headache right now. I have managed to get some weight back with eating carbs but im still feeling like im wasting away and thats one scary feeling I can tell. Everytime I see someone with some weight I think "now thats health, not this malabsorption syndrome aka autoimmune reactions with most of foods aka Death its around the Corner".

Anyway, I will start with the Glutamine soon! I only hope I dont die with seizures because of Glutamate cerebral overload lol
 

Beyond

Juice Me Up, Scotty!!!
Messages
1,122
Location
Murcia, Spain
Im just about buying the Micronized Glutamine, Pure Advantage brand, Pharmatheutical Grade. Im wondering if I should buy the Japanese Micronized Ajinomoto of Dymatize instead though, but has 200 grams less of Glutamine. Should I take the 15 grams all together or divided in 5 gram doses? Also, using Peptopro or other easily digestible protein its mandatory or not? Did you used that all the way, for how long? Its quite expensive, because for a month suppy the daily dosage would be only 20 grams, so 17 of protein. Its still super neat compared with wasting the money in free form aminos in capsules or seacure which only will provide like 6 grams of protein. But I dont think I need it, I mean, since using digestive enzymes (GB3) my digestion its much better and I think I can get enough aminoacids from meat etc when the leaky gut starts to heal. So the digestive enzymes thing its already covered, the diet, and the metabolic supplements too. I just did things backwards, again :rolleyes:
 

Gestalt

Senior Member
Messages
251
Location
Canada
I'm wondering if I should buy the Japanese Micronized Ajinomoto of Dymatize instead though, but has 200 grams less of Glutamine. Should I take the 15 grams all together or divided in 5 gram doses? Also, using Peptopro or other easily digestible protein its mandatory or not? Did you used that all the way, for how long?
It's tough choosing between brands, you want what's the best quality but have no objective way of knowing which one is better or if it even makes a quantifiable difference. Go based on intuition imo. I would take 5g in the morning 5g in the afternoon and 5g at evening before bed, with juice. Sugar supposedly helps absorption. Drink immediately upon mixing. I only took the peptopro when I felt didn't have the stomach acid to digest heavier proteins. If you can digest meat well with digestive enzymes you may not even really need PeptoPro.

Recently I started using Yasko Amino Acid Spray and the SHMT spray and RNA. People with full SHMT defects (like me); according to Yasko it's considered a priority mutation that often leads to gut issues. The SHMT spray has had a noticeable effect on my gut health. My gut subjectively feels more "hardy". :)
 

Beyond

Juice Me Up, Scotty!!!
Messages
1,122
Location
Murcia, Spain
Hmm I still need to decide! But im kinda tilting towards the most expensive (but smaller dosage) and here is why: http://www.amazon.com/Dymatize-Nutr...dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

I need to get the good one because my parents are who pay and they have already seen like 35 types of supplements coming into my home and no real improvement. I have also been to naturopaths and specialised docs who charged me much more expensive supplements and therapies (which were the least effective!!?) Its not true that I never got an improvement, but its what they believe. Actually, some supplements made a difference, but wasnt enough to keep buying them. I got rid of my penis pain with an hypoallergenic diet, methylation supplements made my social phobia, joy for life and overall feeling much better until I crashed with a psychotic attack (I speculate that it was the TMG). I never tried Indoplex DIM and even while the guys at my forum of origin we used to chatter about it. That was stupid since I have high estradiol and estriol in all tests. My libido its completely screwed. I cry easily with movies, emotional and estrogenic haha. So thats one supplement I really want to try.

Yeah if you can afford Yasko supplements its great. I think you are gonna reach 100% recovery since you have the resources and focus to do it. I will get there too, some day ;)
 

Beyond

Juice Me Up, Scotty!!!
Messages
1,122
Location
Murcia, Spain
Bought it! Finally decided to use the most expensive, with feedback. Fingers crossed!! Silver bullet, please do the job for me too! :D
 

freshveggies

Senior Member
Messages
196
The short answer.

VDR Taq:
VDR Taq TT = +/+ (red, complete defect) tolerates more methyl donors
VDR Taq tt = ‐/- (green, no defect) tolerates fewer methyl donors
VDR Taq Tt = +/- (Yellow, partial defect)

VDR Fok:
VDR Fok ff = +/+ (red, full defect)
VDR Fok FF = ‐/- (Green, no defect)
VDR Fok Ff = ‐/+(Yellow, partial defect)

I just ran my raw data through genetic genie (i did dontate and thank you) My question. I have the Yasko test in front of me and I am VDR TT ---my raw data says I am AA and acording to genetic genie -/- But Yasko says that TT is homo.
This is what snedia says:
VDR Gene
they say the rist allele is GG. Then why am I AA and Yasko says TT? Is this one just backwards according to what Yasko has figured out?
 

kday

Senior Member
Messages
369
I just ran my raw data through genetic genie (i did dontate and thank you) My question. I have the Yasko test in front of me and I am VDR TT ---my raw data says I am AA and acording to genetic genie -/- But Yasko says that TT is homo.
This is what snedia says:
VDR Gene
they say the rist allele is GG. Then why am I AA and Yasko says TT? Is this one just backwards according to what Yasko has figured out?

The results are identical from what I have seen. I wasn't aware that 23andMe was reportng VDR Fok. The alleles are different, but I'm currently using the official Risk Allele which is G. For Yasko, GG is -/-. I will assume that she doesn't agree with the risk allele on this one. But she made a post somewhere about VDR confusion and how she was going to change the interpretation.

Recently there has been a barrage of questions related to VDR. The situation with respect to VDR is highly complex which is why I have not tried to thoroughly explain it in the past. I have tried to keep it simple for you and note the observed clinical relationship between those who cannot tolerate higher levels of methyl donors (tt) and those that can handle more methyl donors (TT) in terms of their Taq status. Based on the volume of questions and confusion regarding VDR I will go ahead and explain the complexity of the situation.

I believe this recent flurry of interest in the genotype designations for the VDR is related to of the use of GcMAF. While initially it was thought that the VDR SNP data played a role in determining the use of that agent, it has since been suggested that simply the use of Vitamin D may be a help. As such this focus on VDR may not be necessary. I had reached a similar conclusion with regard to vitamin D for my program a while ago with the additional caveat that I feel support for the receptors is also important. The bottom line is that I do feel vitamin D support is a positive, and the use of rosemary, sage and resveratrol can also help support healthy vitamin D levels.

First a quick point of nomenclature before I go in to the complexity of the situation. In general the presence of the restriction site is denoted by a lower case letter and the polymorphism that eliminates the site is denoted by an upper case letter. The situation is more complex in that the Bsm and Taq sites have an inverse relationship. To add to the confusion, studies have found decreased levels of VDR protein with Bsm BB and Taq tt genotypes compared to other genotypes yet vitamin D levels were significantly increased at the same time that levels of VDR protein were significantly decreased. Thus increased 1,25(OH)2 D3 levels, might lead to downregulation of VDR expression. Decreased VDR levels could result in defective VDR signaling.( JOURNAL CLINICAL IMMUNOLOGY Volume 29, Number 4 (2009), 470-478 )

The situation with Fok is also complex as the polymorphism (FF, loss of site) actually leads to the production of a protein with increased activity. The Fok SNP, situated in exon 2, gives rise to an alteration in the start codon position resulting in a 3 amino acid longer protein produced by the F allele. So the Fok site affects the protein directly such that those who are missing the restriction site (FF) make a shorter protein, but one that is actually more active. While those who do not have a ‘mutation’ and have the restriction site actually make the full length protein but it has less activity.(Nutrition Reviews, What Are the Frequency, Distribution, and Functional Effects of Vitamin D Receptor Polymorphisms as Related toCancer Risk?Nicholas J. Rukin August 2007(II): S96 –S101Vol. 65, No. 8). In conclusion, the Fok polymorphism yields a 424 VDR variant somewhat more active than the 427 variant in terms of its transactivation capacity as a transcription factor. (Uitterlinden et al. / Gene 338 (2004) 143–156)

The Taq and Bsm situation is even more complicated. Both are in a regulatory portion of the protein and the SNP changes do not affect the protein per se but they both affect a regulatory string of A’s in the sequence. Thus the presence or absence of the Bsm and Taq sites affects the number of A’s in the protein. Since Bsm and Taq have inverse effects both Bt and bT impact the number of A’s. The number of A’s in turn affects the stability of the information to make the VDR protein. As with everything else related to VDR, there is disagreement whether the shorter stretch of A’s (Bt) or the longer stretch of A’s (bT) grants more stability to the protein. Reports regarding which genotype is associated with a range of diseases or health conditions vary depending on the researcher.

To try to keep things clear, in the future we will use the tt or TT designation to denote VDR Taq and FF and ff for Fok. Those who are tt should consider limited methyl donors. Those who are TT tend to have a greater tolerance for ie methylB12.

Again, the bottom line is that I do feel low dose vitamin D plus rosemary and sage and resveratrol are a positive for all. This is especially true as there is conflicting literature regarding disease susceptibility and the various VDR SNPS that at times is totally contradictory.
I have enough evidence that VDR Taq is different from Yasko. And as long as she hasn't swapped the risk allele herself, results will match. I'll make the changes today to match Yasko's.
 

freshveggies

Senior Member
Messages
196
The results are identical from what I have seen. I wasn't aware that 23andMe was reportng VDR Fok. The alleles are different, but I'm currently using the official Risk Allele which is G. For Yasko, GG is -/-. I will assume that she doesn't agree with the risk allele on this one. But she made a post somewhere about VDR confusion and how she was going to change the interpretation.

So Risk Allele for Taq is GG----Why do I come out as -/- and I am a AA in 23 and me? I am just trying to understand and just can't get it. Thanks.

I don't know if 23 and me has Fok.

I was thinking for Yasko on Taq -/- is TT she does it backwards for the VDR that is why she does not write in -/- because we would think it is a green and not red?
 

kday

Senior Member
Messages
369
I made the changes. A is now the risk allele.

freshveggies - you come out as AA and -/- because the risk allele was G. Now if you upload your results, you will see the opposite.
 

kday

Senior Member
Messages
369
When alleles are different, you can usually swap an A for a T and C for a G.

So TT=AA.

And I use the word usually because DNA is double stranded, and the other strand doesn't always match up. But in the case of SNPs, they should match up.

If you like pictures, maybe this will make more sense.

ATCG.jpg
 

roxie60

Senior Member
Messages
1,791
Location
Central Illinois, USA
I made the changes. A is now the risk allele.

freshveggies - you come out as AA and -/- because the risk allele was G. Now if you upload your results, you will see the opposite.

Thanks guys for pursuing this, this result (AA full defect) now makes more sense given my health experience. I was stunned to have VDR Taq AA and VDR BSM CC be both no variant with original run and I have such difficult time getting my vit D levels just to the low end of the range (taking 5000-10000 / day). Now VDR Taq would be red even though still -/- due to A being the risk allele (provided I am understanding this stuff at all).

(no data from 23andMe on VDR Fok - I really wish they would add this one and a few of the other methylation SNPs that are missing but they are making progress since it seems version 3 had added some SNPs)