Townsend Letter publishes methylation clinical study paper by Dr. Nathan and RichVanK

[richvank]

Hi, all.

I'm happy to say that the December 2011 issue of the Townsend Letter
is carrying an article about the clinical study of methylation treatment that Dr. Neil Nathan and I carried out.

This is a magazine that is read primarily by practitioners and patients who are interested in
alternative treatments. The editor solicited the article from us for this issue, which is focused on
CFS and fibromyalgia. You can see the contents here:

http://www.townsendletter.com/

Best regards,

Rich

 

[maddietod]

Congratulations! I hope they put the article up on the web at some point.

 

[rydra_wong]

Yes, congrats! The Townsend Letter is one of the most respected health publications out there. Too bad we can't
take a peek at the article w/o buyinng an issue...

Rydra

 

[richvank]

Yes, congrats! The Townsend Letter is one of the most respected health publications out there. Too bad we can't
take a peek at the article w/o buyinng an issue...

Rydra

Hi, Rydra.

It's actually a shortened version of the poster paper that you can read here:


http://aboutmecfs.org.violet.arvixe.com/Trt/TrtMethylStudy09.pdf
or
http://www.mecfs-vic.org.au/sites/w...Article-2009VanKonynenburg-TrtMethylStudy.pdf

Best regards,

Rich

 

[dannybex]

Hi Rich,

Rydra brought my attention to this quote in your study, which seems to both support and conflict with Yasko's theories:

"The data in Figure 4 support Yaskos claim that the CBS C699T polymorphism significantly drains metabolites from the methylation cycle when there is a partial block of methionine synthase. However, during the treatment, though there continued to be differences in the values of SAM +SAH between those who had the polymorphism and those who did not, even those who were homozygous for this polymorphism attained levels of SAM + SAH averaging near the reference value after 6 months of treatment, without compensatory treatment for the presence of this polymorphism."

Am I misunderstanding this, or does it conclude that even if one had a CBS polymorphism, that the end result after six months was a near normalization of SAM/SAH ratios, kind of making it a moot point? Does your study tend to kind of jibe with Jill James study that showed that the autistic cohort in her 2009 study also improved with methylb12 and folinic, despite the 'adaptive' (her term) CBS upregulation?

On a semi-separate note: Can you remind me again, how is folinic different from methylfolate? Why would one use folinic instead of methylfolate?


THANKS AS ALWAYS Rich! And congrats for getting published!

 

[Sean]

Congrats, Rich.

Not in a position to judge the technical value of your work, but really appreciate your ongoing efforts on our behalf.

 

[dannybex]

Bumping for Rich...

 

[richvank]

Hi Rich,

Rydra brought my attention to this quote in your study, which seems to both support and conflict with Yasko's theories:

"The data in Figure 4 support Yaskos claim that the CBS C699T polymorphism significantly drains metabolites from the methylation cycle when there is a partial block of methionine synthase. However, during the treatment, though there continued to be differences in the values of SAM +SAH between those who had the polymorphism and those who did not, even those who were homozygous for this polymorphism attained levels of SAM + SAH averaging near the reference value after 6 months of treatment, without compensatory treatment for the presence of this polymorphism."

Am I misunderstanding this, or does it conclude that even if one had a CBS polymorphism, that the end result after six months was a near normalization of SAM/SAH ratios, kind of making it a moot point? Does your study tend to kind of jibe with Jill James study that showed that the autistic cohort in her 2009 study also improved with methylb12 and folinic, despite the 'adaptive' (her term) CBS upregulation?

On a semi-separate note: Can you remind me again, how is folinic different from methylfolate? Why would one use folinic instead of methylfolate?


THANKS AS ALWAYS Rich! And congrats for getting published!

Hi, Dan.

What we found was that the people who had the CBS upregulating SNP started with fewer metabolites in their methylation cycle, as predicted by Amy Yasko, and their methylation cycle recovered more slowly than those who did not have this SNP, but that their SAMe and SAH levels did come up, even though no specific treatment was given for this SNP.

The simplified treatment is intended to be a "bare bones" version of the full Yasko treatment program. As such, though it is cheaper and simpler, it doesn't necessarily do everything that the full treatment program does. But many people cannot do the full treatment, for financial or cognitive reasons, or both, and the simplified treatment is something that more people can do.

Best regards,

Rich

 

[Rosebud Dairy]

Congratulations!

Hard work does get you somewhere.

I will make my docs aware

 

[Rosebud Dairy]

@RVK

SO many questions........

Is there any anecdotal tracking of MSH or MARCONS by the patients on their own during the study?

Did any of the patients make any (anecdotal) changes to their places of residence during the study, such as repair of water damaged homes?

Theoretically, would concomitant treatment with CSM or Welchol (toxin binding meds) be too much to do at once for a patient, as far as body burden of recovery is concerned, or is this possibly to be encouraged once patient reaches a certain level of healing?

Theoretically, would one do the SMP BEFORE doing Shoemaker's steps, or just get it done when one can as to what one can afford to have tested and treated?

Theoretically, if C4A comes down, then MSH SHOULD BE rising to normal levels, assuming one is out of a WDB.

I am very grateful that there this work is out there tying together methylation with HLA DR/DBQ susceptibility. As these things are, these ideas are just too complicated to even try to explain to someone who has never been sick. Having this type of work published is really encouraging.

 

[dannybex]

Hi, Dan.

What we found was that the people who had the CBS upregulating SNP started with fewer metabolites in their methylation cycle, as predicted by Amy Yasko, and their methylation cycle recovered more slowly than those who did not have this SNP, but that their SAMe and SAH levels did come up, even though no specific treatment was given for this SNP.

The simplified treatment is intended to be a "bare bones" version of the full Yasko treatment program. As such, though it is cheaper and simpler, it doesn't necessarily do everything that the full treatment program does. But many people cannot do the full treatment, for financial or cognitive reasons, or both, and the simplified treatment is something that more people can do.

Best regards,

Rich

Thanks Rich as always. I really appreciate all your work.

One quick question: What was the length of your study again?

d.

 

[richvank]

Thanks Rich as always. I really appreciate all your work.

One quick question: What was the length of your study again?

d.

Hi, Dan.

For 6 months, the patients all received the same basic treatment. Between 6 and 9 months, individualized treatments were added to the basic treatment, depending on individual patient genomics and other test results.

Best regards,

Rich

 

[Rosebud Dairy]

@RVK

SO many questions........

Is there any anecdotal tracking of MSH or MARCONS by the patients on their own during the study?

Did any of the patients make any (anecdotal) changes to their places of residence during the study, such as repair of water damaged homes?

Theoretically, would concomitant treatment with CSM or Welchol (toxin binding meds) be too much to do at once for a patient, as far as body burden of recovery is concerned, or is this possibly to be encouraged once patient reaches a certain level of healing?

Theoretically, would one do the SMP BEFORE doing Shoemaker's steps, or just get it done when one can as to what one can afford to have tested and treated?

Theoretically, if C4A comes down, then MSH SHOULD BE rising to normal levels, assuming one is out of a WDB, and does not have MARCONS.

I am very grateful that there this work is out there tying together methylation with HLA DR/DBQ susceptibility. As these things are, these ideas are just too complicated to even try to explain to someone who has never been sick. Having this type of work published is really encouraging.

__________________________

Last, I printed out the whole thing, all 36 pages, to give to our family physician who also specializes in occupational medicine. She was very glad to have a study with some tie-in to Shoemaker, as this may be applicable to a number of her patients. Being able to bring down TGF-B1 without prescriptions is pretty big, especially for pediatric patients with asthma who can't take a ton of prescriptions.

So many wonderful implications.............

I wonder how Shoemaker will fit this in with his protocol.........fix methylation first or fix MSH first?