Hi Dan
The reason I ask, is isn't glutathione -- in some form of another -- essential for antioxidant protection and to battle oxidative stress? How could we survive without it?
According to what Rich has said and what I have read our body's make glutathione when we start up methylation and have the other needed cofactors, another good reason to take the basics. Another researcher in a phone conversation said that there "is no safe way to take glutathione". So by that standard I, and none of the people involved can even be justified as needing it by reason of methylation block as all of us had successfully restarted methylation with mb12 and Metafolin, typically years before. Maybe that is a factor.
And when you talk about glutathione, are you talking about specific supplemental forms of glutathione, or the glutathione molecule itself?
So, I and 9 others including a vegetarian, all of us different, all of us willing to experiment always looking for more answers and improved results decided to try it becasue of all the whoha on the internet about it, in a variety of forms. I tried it both as a brand name patent combo and as just a pair of precursors. Different people took different precursors and a couple did infusions. Everybody had the same results. Those taking more had them faster. Those taking less took a little longer. The form didn't matter. As we went on some additional people discovered they were taking it in hidden form via two unrelated multi ingredient formulas that together had a precursor set and others mentioned that they had been taking it for some time. It became the single unifying factor for all these "discovered" folks were not making progress on the active b12/folate protocol.
but I've always wondered why you or how you connected glutathione with wiping out your b12/folate levels
I started feeling folate deficiency symptoms within 2 hours of my first glutathione dose. The amount of b12 visible in my urine went up massively. I had never taken a dose of mb12/adb12 that put that much b12 in my urine and this was doing it all the time. In the next few days the angular cheilitis started right up, a key folate deficiency symptom of mine. Then a couple of days later IBS started up with a vengeance, as with folate deficiency. And so it continued, inflammation, allergies, infected follicles, and so on. Over a 6 week period we all suffered a very rapidly increasing severity of a relatively small group of symptoms, 100% of us. Those of us already having the worst neurological damage had our neurological problems made worse. All the symptoms were the return of previous symptoms, no new ones. And they all fit into the description of an affliction popularly called "glutathione detox reaction" and similar variations. At some point, someone, not me, suggested that it had many of the symptoms of folate deficiency and so why don't I try more Metafolin. I did, 4800mcg more than the 800mcg before, the others did and again, 100% response. Within 2 hours the red color disappeared from my urine for almost a week, just like when I started Metafolin in the first place. And then, when I took my next mb12 injection that evening, another BINGO, mb12 startup all over again such as I hadn't had since about the 4th month on mb12. And again when I tried by next dose of adb12 another BINGO, adb12 startup which I had never experienced again after starting adb12 until then. This was 6 months AFTER I had stopped the glutathione. Things had never started up again despite 800mcg/day of Metafolin. I continued with some b12 deficiency symptoms despite injecting 7.5mg twice a day. I was also taking acb12 regularly and none of them seemed to be working. Talk about a setback. I had dropfoot again. That is a scary amount of damage.
Everybody, without exception, had already had strong responses to mb12 and Metafolin and were much improved. If I hadn't aready had massive improvement nothing would have changed when I took glutathione precursors and so I wouldn't haver noticed anything. I would have had massive folate and b12 deficiency symptoms before and I would have still had them after trying glutathione. What's to notice in that case?
Because of the glutathione experience and it's intense severity I was able to recognize the paradoxical folate deficiency when it happened the next half dozen times and via some experimentation figured out the differences in relative timing of folic acid and Metafolin that caused me to have it sometimes and not others.
If this isn't adequate in explaining the recognition of the glutathione role please ask a more specific question.